electro-shock collars

I was in the shop yesterday and walked by the magazines, although I already bought Dogstoday this month, another dog magazine caught my eye, for campaigning to get electroshock collars to be made illegal.
Now I know the average dog lover will think this is a nasty nasty weapon, and I agree that in the wrong hands it could awful, however I did not agree with the all the things that they said:

I do agree that for fear aggression there is absolutly no point in using this device, that would just make things a hundred times worse.
I also agree that teaching the dogs commands like sit and stay by using this, is harmful; it is known that a behaviour learned through positve experiences is stronger than one made with negative assocations.

This is where you will all gasp... I bought one of these on the web last year, it was alot of money, and it was a last resort. This has nothing to do with training at all, or aggression. My tiny terrier is a killer of sheep, and only through luck is he still alive (I had buy the sheep). He is trained in obiedience to a high level, but has such an incredible prey drive, he switches off. I had rats when he was a pup, and he played with them until about 4/5 months he got a nasty glint in his eye and started trying to tear them to pieces (they were fine, he didn't get them) so I don't care what you think, I know that I did my best to introduce him to lots of animals at a young age. It is pure and bare and awful instinct. I would not have a terrier again, however he is my baby and I would protect him with my life (I was thought he had fallen off a cliff and my friends were holding me back as I said I was jumping if he was dead down there, fortuantly he was in a rabbit hole).

The final thing that I disagree with is that it they stated in this article was that it is painful. Before it went anywhere near my dog, I tried it on myself. It is not painful, it is like getting a buzz off the tv or from the car door. It makes you stop for a moment, but I cannot consider it painful.

Finally I only use it in the country, where I am not sure what is around us. I do alot of hill walking, and once over xmas I was on a snowy mountain, and Prinz went off after the sheep. I downed my other dog (didn't have pup then) and buzzed Prinz who stopped and looked at me. I screamed 'LEAVE' at him, and he came back. His other problem is that he grumbles at male dogs when he first meets them, and I have been tempted to use this, but there are other ways. I am clicker training a positive (no grumble) outcome, and it seems he is getting slightly better.

Ok you can tell me how you all feel.

I have never given this topic much thought but I must confess I would never use one

In the right hands they can be used as the last resort I guess (and I know what his prey drive is like it was him who killed one of our chickens wasnt it) ,like in your situation ,after all look at all the farmers ,horse keepers etc. that use electric fences to keep their animals in
Just one thing what happened to the sheep you had to buy

hello.... still upset about that poor bird - he doesn't even pause, if it's alive, it must be killed. It is upsetting for me, because I hate to see animals hurt or die. But I guess I love him more (stupid emotions) everyone said to me I have to put him to sleep, but the farmer was shocked that little him brought down a good sized lamb. He went straight for the throat, killed it outright. The horrible thing is that he just walks away, like it is his duty to stop things from living. When it happened I thought I was going to run away with him, just hide out somewhere. I don't know why I have such strong feelings for him. Someone needs to give him a good kick up the back side. But I can't. I have been tough on him lately though, as he fought with Jaz and they both came away with bits hanging off. He needs bringing down a peg or too, I find it hard as he is so little.
Anyway, as I said I only use it to prevent him from killing. It is like he is a little wolf. Oh yeah and people keep telling me that i shouldn't feed raw meat to him. This happened before I fed raw, and I do not believe it has anything to do with it. He does not hang around to eat what he kills.
By the way he is amazing with my horse, and they play together and even share food from the same container. My dogs follow me out with the horse no problems, it is wonderful. He isn't interested in cows either, as they chased him as a pup... he just likes things that run so he can put a stop to it.

Here he is the killer wolf.....

aww bless!!! How can he hurt anything

lol in that picture of him you would think butter wouldnt melt in his mouth

To be totally honest, I don't understand why on earth you let him off the lead when he's killed already. If I've read this wrong then sorry...but you are saying you allow him off lead near livestock???????
If that's the case then I'm pretty appalled. If not I apologise wholeheartedly. I NEVER allow my dogs offlead near livestock and never would. (They've never hurt anything touch wood). You're lucky the farmer didn't shoot your dog ( as cute as he is).
There are sooooooo many people on here who have dog aggressive dogs who very responsibly keep them onlead where there's any chance of contact with other dogs ( I totally admire them), this is a similar situation. (In my opinion). To then compound that by using a shock collar....I have to admit I'm pretty dumbfounded by it. If you had him onlead he wouldn't need it.
I'm really sorry if I misread your posts...

Dont like em, but each to their own

no you didn't mis-read it. As I said I do alot of hill walking and I don't and can't keep him on the lead all the time. Having said that he is never out of my sight, and once in a blue moon we come across sheep. Deer are not a problem, as little short legs loses them very quickly, but sheep are not so fast. My dogs are hardly ever on a lead, unless we go somewhere near roads, or down the town. I am sorry but it's just the way I am. I carry a lead with me incase we come across rottweilers or other huge dogs he doesn't like, but other than that we do alright. He has never had a full blown fight except with his 'brother', Jaz, but as I said he does grumble as if to say 'oi, I am boss around these parts'.
I just this minute got back from two hours on the beach (I have a great job!) and we met a dog walking company who has 20 dogs (there are 4 people there, it is still alot of dogs together!) so 24 including mine and my parents dog was there. We just sat and watched them play for about 15 mins they all ran about in the surf, young and old, they had a great time. I wasn't worried about Prinz fighting, he isn't like that, in fact he seemed a little over-whelmed at all the dogs he was better behaved than usual! So I guess mine is an unusual problem, and if these collars were to be made illegal, I guess i would just have to restrain him. I personally hate any animal to be restrained, they should be allowed freedom, but obviously not at the cost of their or others lives.

And the sheep,rats and bird he killed.....