Vigilante..has the time come?

With the upsurge in crime and the decrease in the number of police I wonder if more and more people will become vigilantes.

Clive and I are always up the front when something is going on, we are members of various neighbourhood watch and dog watch schemes in an attempt to keep our area as crime free as possible. I know some people are too scared to get involved or just can't be bothered, Clive and I are both of the same mentality in that we dive in first and think about it later.

About 8 weeks ago I was fast asleep in the spare room when Clive came stumbling in. He had been taking sleeping tablets to try to help with his insomnia which was effecting his health, with my snoring I felt it best to go into the spare room. Anyway, he woke me up to tell me that there was something going on in our front garden, he opened up the window and called out to someone whilst I got my slippers on, turned the alarm off and went downstairs. I didn't know who was out there or what they were doing but the fact that they were uninvited was enough to make me want to see what was going on...(as I said, I act first and then feel sick when I think what could have happened).

It transpired that there were two gothic girls squatting in our garden One was very slighly built but the other was like a tank, I'm very big built at the moment and she made me look like a midget. They were making so much racket that the neighbour opposite had also come to her bedroom window to see what was going on. I told them that they should leave or I would call the police, no beating about the bush, they weren't just tiddling on the garden and I had no intention of clearing up after them so tried to send them on their way. At this point Clive came downstairs, he was quite out of it really because of the sleeping tablets, but he followed me outside. By this time the big girl had got me in the corner, hurled obscenities at me and threatened to punch my lights out. I stood up to her, not swearing but stood my ground and told her that she was invading my private space, there is a huge field with bushes just across the road, if she was that desperate she could easily have squatted over there instead of in my front garden.

She continued to threaten me, she said she knows where I live and would come to get me, by this time Clive was on the phone to the police as he thought I was about to get flattened, this girl even dwarfed him and he thought she was going to hit him too. Whilst he was on the phone the operator could hear what was going on, she could hear the swear words and the threats and said she would get a unit to us immediately. It was at this point that the smaller girl convinced the big girl to make a move.

As they went our neighbour hang out of the window and called to me to see if I was ok, she said she had heard everything and was watching carefully as she would be a witness if the girl had attacked me. The police then called Clive back and said they wouldn't be with us as something more important had cropped up!

The police came to visit us the next evening, I gave them a full statement, as did the neighbour, they decided against getting any information from Clive due to him being under the influence of the sleeping tablets at the time of the incident. We gave the police an identical description of this girl...she is absolutely huge and really stands out so there is no way someone wouldn't know who she was, we also gave them a lipstick that was left behind in the hope they could find out who it was. It may sound petty that this girl had just wanted to relieve herself but, if you had heard the tone of her voice and what she was actually saying to me, I think the bravest of us would have been a bit worried.

Anyway, the police contacted us the next day to say that they had made enquiries and no-one had seen or heard of the girl we described but if we saw her again then we were to call them immediately. Clive saw her coming out of a house and she has gone past our house twice since, on each occasion we have phoned the police to let them know she is around the area, what she is wearing etc.

The last call we made was this Sunday just gone, we reported as we were told to, I then got chastised by the chap that took my call to the effect that I was wasting their time so I told him not to bother and hung up. I then got a call from a woman who asked what was happening, I told her not to bother as Clive would follow her next time to see where she goes so we can tell them precisely where to pay her a visit as they had not taken any action from our previous calls. Now, bear in mind that the original police woman who came to see us the day after said that this was a serious offence, both the defficating and the threatening behaviour and that they would charge her if they could find her. Had she told us to forget about it we would have been peeved but not been as vigilant as we have been about keeping an eye out for the girl.

I then got a call from the original police woman telling me that I was to tell Clive not to follow the girl otherwise he will be arrested for harrassment

We have decided we aren't going to involve the police any more, we are going to deal with things ourselves...what is the point if they don't have the manpower to deal with this sort of thing? I understand totally that someone deficating in my garden at 2 in the morning and then threatening me with all sorts when I dare to confront them is probably nothing in comparison to the speeding/drunk/drug related crimes that go on, but why should we be made to feel the ones in the wrong when we try to do everything right?

Clive and I have been talking at length about this, he feels that there will be more and more vigilantes as time goes on, people are sick to death of not being able to protect themselves in their own homes, it seems that the law is always on the side of the criminals in this PC world

I just wondered what others thought.

I Must admit I tend to think later too.

I think more people will take the law into their own hands but the trouble is you hear so many tragic stories about people that have done.

I would of been very annoyed too if someone had done this in my garden. Many years ago when we lived in Brentwood the house next door to us was rented out to a lovely young girl and her small son we had our two boys quite young as well. One of the rooms was let to a young lad who was into drugs and poor Debbie had to put up with this. We were disturbed in the early hours by young men in a car making a dreadful racket with music and some hammering on Debbie's door, I was out of bed and confronting them even though Gorden was stumbling out of bed trying to find something to wear and telling me to wait too late I was there and in the thick of it. They threatened to put my arm in the car door and slam it in it I stood my ground and told them to try it silly I know I was so worried about Debbie and Thomas I didn't care.

Eventually they calmed down and listened when I said Gorden was on the phone to the police he wasn't they didn't know that. I explained the house was shared and a young woman and her baby lived there too and in future if they had problems with the young lad too sort it out elsewhere. I later found out Debbie and Thomas were at her mums that night. Do I regret jumping in with both feet first no.

We did ring the police and gave them the reg no of the car whether anything was done or not I don't know but I had done what I thought was right at the time they had disturbed me and possibly frightened the life out of two people I cared for.

Mark is the same and I must say it frightens me more to think of him confronting some of these yobs than me doing it.

This is a really difficult one. The case of Gary Newlove comes to mind. He was a father who lived in Warrington. Went outside to move some youths away from his house and was kicked to death while his family watched.....I guess I would rather clean up than have this happen.......

Yeah me too Rachel. Even though I'm the local Victor Meldrew around here, I know when to gob off and at who, but I'd draw a line (a very big line) at actually confronting somebody who was in my front garden, and in actual fact, I don't think I'd even risk letting the dogs out there quite honestly if push came to shove. We're constantly being told about putting ourselves in this kind of danger, there's been too many poor, innocent people murdered just through trying to protect their own property, and quite honestly, I don't value any of our property that much to risk being injured, maimed, knifed or lose my dogs thankyou, I'd just pick up the phone, chill out and let them deal with it whilst I stayed safe indoors. Oh, I'd probably yell my abuse out of the top window, that's me, I couldn't help but do that, but put myself iin danger? Nah! My life to me is far more important than somebody taking a dump in my garden I'm afraid!

We once owned a big guest house, and I got up in the night to go to the kitchen for some water which was quite a long way to walk all in the dark. I then saw a flashing light at the back door, then it suddenly clicked, it was somebody's torch, they were trying to break in they had already got into the utility room and now they were at the back door I quietly and quickly ran back to get hubby, then I picked up the phone, I told him NOT to go out there, so he opened the patio doors, only to see two dark figures sliding their way along the garage wall, so he lets the dogs out there I can't believe he did that!!!! They could have had knives or worse Thankfully, our big girl, chased them down the drive, but didn't catch them before they jumped the low driveway gates (lesson learned, we now have 6ft wooden ones here!!!).

A few weeks later, it was mid-morning, I was cleaning, I went out into the utility room and noticed that there were no jackets hanging up on the hook, thought to myself, hmmm, funny then as I looked out through the back door, there was my big gsd just sitting there, with these two guys (the SAME two guys it turned out!) pinned up against the wall, she wasn't barking or lungeing at them, she just had them pinned there in terror, by the mere size of her prescence, so I knew they wouldn't be going anywhere, I said nothing to them, except that I was going to get the phone to call the police! Lol! They obviously arrested them, BUT, when they came round to see us a few weeks later, they told us that we had picked a couple of good'uns here, because their parents just happened to be the biggest criminals in the town......... so did I REALLY want to press charges????? Nah!! They agreed!!!!

That would be Ollie getting them trapped so they had nowhere to go.

When I stepped in that was a good few years ago and I think things were very different then you didn't hear the horror stories you do now.

I would think twice now but if anyone was physically harming someone I am not sure I could just stand there, that might be the one thing I would still go hell for leather at.

I used to think it was a persons responsibility in society to stand against violence and theives etc. then we went outside to support a neighbour who was having abuse shouted at him and witnessed him being murdered. It ended his life and has effected us all. So right or wrong - I turn the other way, I wouldn't get involved again.

Well I would have probably turned the garden hose on the dirty b*tch and left it at that.

Thanks for all the replies

Kicks...I am so sorry you had to witness the murder, how awful and, as you say, something that will haunt you forever xx

When I lived alone I wouldn't have dared venture outside if I heard anything, but then I had all the dogs to protect me. I suppose I feed off Clives adrenalin and I hate to think that I would ever be too scared to stick up for myself, but I totally understand what you are saying...if I were to challenge someone then I only have myself to blame if something happened, and this is what makes me feel so sickly after the event, I think about what could happen.

I had a couple of kids trying to climb into the garden once. Daisy went and grinned at them and they went away.

Well done Daisy