Please do not be so rude too Lizzy23 she does a very good job at rescuing and rehoming badly bred and unwanted springers and does not deserve the remarks you have made.

She tirelessly fund raises for the organization that these unwanted dogs are taken in by. She deserves respect for what she does and what she knows about this breed.

You would do well too listen and take on board what she is saying you would a learn a lot from her.

Where did I post for sale? I posted in pictures of cross breeds

Great! Now why does that make me a bad owner.

and again, how do you know. You know nothing about me, I may work in the local re-homing centre, I may be a qualified vet, I may research canine skeletal disorders. I'm sure I could learn alot from her, but don't you feel that comment is slightly condescending, especially as you have no knowledge of me?

Where in that post did I say you were a bad owner ?

I said you would do well to listen too what Lizzy has too say she has been doing this for a long time and has the fall out drop at her door every day.

I think you are reading things into posts that are not there yes the majority of people are put out that you have decided to breed from two breeds that have have health issues as most breeds have I agree, without testing most of the people on here are breeders and have been for years and some do not breed anymore but they still have a wealth of knowledge.

If you are referring to the sentence learning a lot from her that in no way implies you are bad owner.

Misguided with your breeding practice yes bad owner no.

Well the implication, as far as I saw it (and plenty of other people have made comments to the same end) of bringing up the number of dogs in rescue, collies, springers, was that my dogs would end up in rescue centres, reading back, I think I may have read to much into those comments and I genuinely apologise if I appear rude in my response (I don't think I was, but never mind).

As it was the debate was about how many working dogs form part of the re-homing problems, and I stick to my contention, not many. Her view of the world is probably different. All I can say is most of teh unwanted dogs up here in the north of cumbria end up in the Animal Refuge. I've been tehre plenty of time, in fact my uncle used to work there, and ex-working dogs form very little of their problems, and all the experience I have of farmers/working breeders is that they are good responsible people, perhaps Cumbria is a shinning example, I don't know, but I hold to my experience and contention.

i'm out of here theres no talking to some people, just hope i don't get asked to take a sprollie anytime soon, i truly hope your pups don't have to come back to you, but i also stand by what i said 250 + working strain springers rehomed last year, obviously there's no problem with working dog breeders, and actually we cover cumbria as well and have had our fair share from over there, as well as the rest of the country

Well you sure as hell aren't a vet!

rune

I agree with the majority on this one.

You can glorify yourself and why you believe you were doing the best for your dogs as much as you like, but in truth, you weren't. If you were, you'd have health tested first (hips and eyes at least).

I don't agree with breeding crossbreeds for pets or working when there are so many crossbreeds wasting away in rescue centres countrywide. If you or your girlfriend wanted another dog, specifically a crossbreed, you could've went to a rescue centre instead of bringing more in to existance just bacause your partner wanted another dog.

I'm not a breed snob, I have a pedigree and a crossbreed - my crossbreed is a rescue and all future crossbreeds will be as well. I love crossbreeds and whilst I do agree that generally they are healthier than some pedigree dogs due to the hybrid vigour in the gene pool, they are not totally excluded at all from health issues such as hip and elbow dysplasia, PRA, epilepsy, internal organ issues and such like - which is why you should've health tested BEFORE breeding these two dogs. THEN, providing all health tests were suitable, should you have considered breeding them (even though I don't agree with you breeding them at all).

You can't just assume that the puppies will be healthy because their young parents seem healthy, that's not how it works at all, hence the health testing. For all you know, they could be affected by conditions which haven't surfaced yet or carriers of issues such as epilepsy.

When it comes to dogs health, you should NEVER just assume as you just never know who could be lurking inside them unless they are health tested - and that goes for both crossbreeds and pedigree dogs.

Again, what is the reason for the condescension? I ahev not demeid you or your knowledge, what reason do you have to demean mine? And why does it seem ok for regular members to do this????

Yeah, I hope you don't, but if you do, it won't be one of mine, trust me (I have been extremely careful housing these dogs, and the implication of what you are saying seems to imply you think I haven't, maybe I'm wrong)

250+ working springers, out of how many dogs in rescue centres last year? I would still say that forms a small part of the problem.

But to continue to breed pedigrees when dogs remain in rescue centre is ok? Why? People keep making this point, but never go onto explain it.

BTW I agree with most of the rest of your post, except the fact you are ignoring the fact I checked the dogs history about before hand, and did plenty of research to.

Like I've said before, the only legitimate critism is the lack of HIP test, and as I've said before I agree it is a legitimate criticism and I have put forward my reasons in a calm reasonable fashion, but the rest of this scorn and outrage, why?

You are either a troll or a numpty. i really cant decide.

I agree Mish. How about both?