the point of Crufts and any other animal assessment is to compare the stock from one breeder against another - I breed Groenendaels a numerically small breed- I live in an isolated rural environment (the middle of the Lincolnshire Fens) and if it were not for dog shows I would very rarely meet with another example of my breed and thus be unable to compare what I am producing against what other breeders are - without Crufts and other dog shows we would all simply be breeding our own interpretation of what the breed should look like in isolation from each other- we would be unable to see the breed 'as a whole' be unable to view possible stud dogs and see what they have produced and be unable to view dogs from other countries that we may need to use to widen our gene pools....and by seeing them 'in the flesh' we can get a truer picture of how they would improve any faults we may have in our own lines - tell me how else we could do this ?

Every breed of animal is assessed in this way - go to an Agricultural, show and you will see cattle, sheep, pigs, goats etc etc all being assessed against their own breed for exactly the same reasons -why only this witch hunt against dog showing ?



I go to Crufts because I know I will see the best examples of my breed all in one place - and a high placing amongst such good competition gives me some insight into the quality of what I am producing ....all invaluable stuff to me as a breeder !

Well said - good post
I hope to be going - have been trying to get there the last few years but something always came up last minute.

I want to go, to see the UK's best examples of the breed/s I'm interested in. I also want to meet up with people I know or used to know or have yet to meet (yourself & your dogs included Bijou!). Learning about & following a particular breed (or activity) makes it even more special, more important than the shopping.... well maybe

Whether I go this year or not, when I do go again (have been before years ago when it was still in London) it will put a lot of puzzle pieces in place and I'll come away a lot more knowledgeable and probably even more in love with my favourite breeds.

But I wouldnt see the best examples of border collies if I went
Thats what sheepdog trials are for

a brilliant feeling indeed ...

Right Pidge, I'll try and catch up with everything outstanding.

Firstly, yes sorry, I did miss your post apologising for the comments about show dogs being put through torture (but apologising for something doesn't mean you didn't say it in the first place)...

You next said that you had proved all your other facts, the majority of which were put in this post:

THe Iams thing - fair enough, its consistent with your principles.
The cruelty cases for judges and exhibitors, what evidence do you have on this? Do you say they were allowed to participate with the KC having full knowledge of the convictions? Or if not, is it that a small number of people who have won and/or have judged have subsequently been convicted?
I admit, its not good news to hear (I did a google and found a handful of cases over the past 10 years), but I don't see how Crufts/the KC are to blame?
The breeding issues. How do you know exactly what is and isn't being done, are you purely following what Jemima H says? Do you know what is/isn't wrong with all breds and what is being done? Jemima H didn't cover a fraction of what is being done in her programme.

As for the other bits about hot warehouses, 12 hours tied to the bench, the dogs being stressed etc. the show goers have given enough proof that this is not the case.

On to the links you posted:
Iams - again, I've got nothing really to say on that; its your personal principles, which is fair enough.

Jemima's blog.
Well I'm sorry but i have no respect for this woman. She's in a positin where she could've done so much good but I think she has failed big time. Yes, some changes have been made (a speed up of what whas happening anyway) but I truly believe that the backlash of the public's perception of ALL pedigree dogs and breeders has given the puppy farmers cross-breed factories a massive boost.

And she also admits that the evidence she has shows that many purebreeds are more healthy than crossbreeds (based on longevity of life) its just that overall, the average for crossbreeds is slightly higher than the average for purebreeds.

yes sensationalism makes people sit up, but at what cost? You think it is sometimes right - was Tony Blair righ to sensationalise WMD to support what he wanted to do in Iraq?

For a documentary to be taken seriously it should always give both sides a fair go and this is something she didn't do (and openly admits it).

I think I've covered all your points, but if I've missed anything, let me know.

Im not a fan of showing at all and I think its that the dogs are considered stock by some not saying that you actually consider your dogs as stock but you did use the phrase. Its the same as some other dog 'activities'.

I understand the comparing and trying to improve the breed and finding the right stud but no showing is not for me - not that I could with my lot anyway even though I do have a pedigree

Would you like to point out exactly where I was unpleasant, oh and while your at it I've proven thay Iams didnt have a trade stand at Crufts last year as they were not on the trade stands list.

That's not a serious question surely

Whats the point of Crufts, if not to make money..

Which bit of Crufts is that directed at?

Perhaps, but was working? Then said she didnt understand anyway.

No, thats where to see the best working Collies. Many working Collies look like mongrels. Many farmers dont care what they look like. Id say some of the best looking Collies that work Ive seen, are Moobli's. I reckon some of hers could compete in the ring too, now THAT is what a Collie should look like! Brains and beauty!