Doberman Scared - Help please

My Doberman, Spike, is 1 year and 6 months. Since we bought him, he has been for puppy socialization and all kinds of training with the Idea to prepare him for man work. We stay in SA (only 2 women and a child) and need him as a guard dog. Spike stays with us in the house except for working hours when he is outside on his own. We discovered that he is extremely scarred of the gardener and other workers around the house and hides in the plants on gardening days (no lawnmower / or load noises on the day) or when workers are around. Last week a technician came to fix my ADSL line, and as i let him in the yard- Spike pee-ed himself and hid away, tail between the legs. I desperately need advise - We have spend a huge amount of money on training for him, and got him not only as a family pet but ALSO for protection. Any HELP will be appreciated.

I would rehome him to a pet home and buy a good alarm system.

(*scared?)

Sorry but it doesn't sound as if this dog is suitable for that role, either from his point of view or yours.

However good the training you need the right temperament dog to start.

Although good dogs can be ruined by poor training, temperamentally unsuitable dogs are unlikely to be made suitable, however good the training.

Has he been overfaced or had bad experiences leading to him being nervous?

However if a dog is naturally nervous or fearful, however good the training you cannot change the dog's genetic temperament and, whether through genetics or leaning, a nervous dog, despite training, would be likely to revert to type under pressure.

Do remember that guard dogs are themselves very vulnerable to attack, and have no defence against gunfire.

I see your from S Africa.

Having said that, if you have internet... I am sure you could invest in a good alarm system which would be much more effective. It is not fair on the dog.

He sounds like a rather unhappy dog...

I would suggest either accept he will never be a guard dog, and let him relax and enjoy him as a pet OR find him a caring new home.

But please for the sake of your dog, don't carry on as you are - it's not fair to him.

As a puppy, was he confident or shy, generally?

It would be useful to know more about what sort of training he has had, he is pretty young really and mentally is probably quite a way off maturing. So if he has been doing some sort of man work, he may feel overwhelmed by that too ... I'm only guessing as I hve no idea of course exactly what he's been trained for and how. Also if a male trainer was a bit harsh with him, or if the gardener has been harsh with him, (yelling at him to get off the flower beds for example, or for pooing in the wrong place?) that would explain a lot.

How is he with men generally? not men he knows, but strangers?

Overall, I agree he's not really right for this and will probably be pretty unhappy. I guess it's a tradition in SA to have guard dogs, but as someone said, they can't be protected really against bullets ... is there no other solutiion? Could he be a pet dog, and some other guard system be put in place?

best wishes
Wys
x

Was he sent away for training or where you present when he was?

It sounds to me as if he has been'trained' an a completely inappropriate manner.

Just because hes a dobermann (or gsd, rott for that matter) it doesnt mean hes going to be a guard dog. I did all sorts with my boy when he was younger and took an interest in schutzhund and he did well on the tracking and obedience element but when it came to man work he just wasnt interested and no amount of cajolling with a flirt pole, bite bag or sleeve would he do it. He would become stressed and glue himself to me when the trainer tried his level best to get him interested. He will play with me with a bite sleeve on but no one else and he prefers to steal it and chew it hence it is now a draught excluder at the front door and gets dragged about from time to time.

Conversely his Dad is one of the highest scoring if not the highest scoring SCH3 Dobe in the uk (im assuming his general fluffiness comes form his mums side! )

So its more about the breeding not the actual breed.

My boyf was brought up in zambia and had a Dobe called Sooty who was a fully trained protection dog and a protection trained GSD called Tanya who looked after the family. Sooty was a finally skilled terror machine and came from a long line of man scarers! There was never any question what she would turn out to be, she just had it in her from day one.

Knowing my Dobe and my previous one I dont think you are from this point going to turn this chap into what you want. If you are adamant that you need a guard dog then send this fella to a pet home and get a ready made one from a reputable breeder and trainer.

Dobes arent as forgiving as some other breeds in my opinion and he wont forget and men will always hold a terror for him which when he grows into himself could become a negative experience for everyone.

Ps Sooty was poisoned and Tanya was found shot and had had cigarettes stubbed out on her nose.

Hello Dobermonkey,

Thank you for the insight.... I'm gonna have to give what you said some serious thought... i would think... right now.. i'm a bit between all the money i have spend on him, as well as the training.. then also... my son loves him to bits and will never forgive me for replacing him... was hoping there was a way of getting him to be vicious somehow ( not afraid of ANY THING) ... ?... gonna give it some thought.

Dear Wys,

Let me give some further info on the training and general characteristic.

We bought Spike at the age of 8 weeks (two months). Biggest Red puppy in the litter, and very confident.

1) At the age of 4 months he was sent for puppy socialization which lasts for 2 weeks and has the purpose of socializing and exposing the puppy to various sounds and different animals and people as well as other dogs etc. (nothing hectic) although they do also learn the basic commands like "sit", "down", "stay" and "heel"

2) At 5 months of age we joined: Puppy land for one month. This is a puppy school where they train the owner with the dog about general social behaviour and basic commands plus few little obstacles. This lasted for 1 month (1 hour on Saturdays) And was good fun.

3) Month 6: Spike went back to Brave Heart for obedience training. This was for a period of 2 months. From my understanding they emphasized obedience on all the basic commands plus did a bit of man-work where Spike was trained to "watch HIM!" and to "attach" . They did give us a demonstration and according to my limited knowledge Spike did well .... He got aggressive, and attached the guy with the sack... ? * ? he seemed confident - ?

4) Month 8 - 13 (6 months) - he was at home without any training except - My son is taking him for 1 to 4- hour play sessions every day were they sometimes practiced the commands and play mostly.

5) Month 14, 15, 16 (we joined K9 school where owner and dog trains together). June, July and August we have been attending classes at K9 every Saturday for one hour. No man work yet - just refining All commands "sit", stay, wait, Heel, on-the-move recall, no food from strangers, obstacles, - all in group setup.

Generally Spike seems to be doing well with the obedience - he is not scared of other people or other dogs. He seems confident and very friendly to all our friends, even the male ones.

I am not sure if a gardener, or security guard did something to him in our absence - and sometimes i get the impression Spike is only scared for Blacks ? - not sure because. Spike appears VERY aggressive when we are in the house or in the car with him, while strangers approach. It is only occasionally when he's been left outside, with Blacks that the hiding away or "peeing"-thing happens.

I am honestly not sure what to make of it - maybe there has been an incident that we're not aware of which caused the dent in confidence - We have just put a lot of hard work into him, and would hate to start all over.... Guess for the sake of all of us, we hope that whatever might have gone wrong can be fixed?

Are you saying he reacts badly to black Africans since you sent him for residential training?
I think this may not be a problem we in the UK can advise on.