Quote Gundog Annie: Crazycockers.The point about this is that Burns markets itself as a totally holistic food. Therefore, they have led their customers to believe that there is are no additives whatsoever in their food just meat and rice!!! They have been less than honest when this was first brought to the public domain and that is why I think people have lost faith in them.


Exactly my point...you've hit the nail on the head there. Us loyal customers have been lead up the garden path with Burns jargon and that's what angers us the most. If we had known in the beginning what was going into their food, at least we could have made a choice but it appears they prefer to lure us in with promises and then refuse to keep us informed when the cat is out of the bag so to speak...disgusting way to treat customers.

I feed Burns because I believe it to be one of the best foods on the market. I'm quite happy that Burns ensure that my dog gets the complete range of vitamins and minerals and would distrust a diet that failed to ensure that.
That's one of the reasons I feed complete food, along with the vast majority of dog owners, inclusing numerous Crufts winners and breeders in the UK.
I am equally confident that the levels of any ingredient included in John Burns' recipes are safe. I have a very healthy dog.
Annie, you seem have a vested interest in the subject, is that right?

Hmmm interesting?

Personally for my little old fella I will continue to feed Burns, he's the fittest he's ever been and I'm not going to jepordise his health over a small amount of synthetic vitamin that apparentely is harmless in small amounts.

Feeding a natural homemade diet isn't as easy as it seems. Whilst reading Dr. Pitcairns book it's amazing how much effort needs to go in to a "complete" natural diet. Meat veg and rice simply isnt enough, it's far more complcated than that which is why I'm sticking to Burns while he's fit and healthy on it.

Tan, if you read through all of this thread you will see that Annie has been totally honest about her interest in this. Please see her post on page 6.

HI Tan

I was actually just about to pm you with my reply. However, you seem to be adamant that I answer your question on the forum so here goes!!!

You are quite wrong by saying I have a vested interest in the subject. I believe that dogs should be fed on a natural diet and by that I want to know what's in the food, so I prepare it myself. My dogs are fed on a completely 100% natural diet (which I make myself!) and they are on 100% natural dog snax (which I make myself!). I have a small business which sells dog food and snax but I am by no means in the same league as Burns or the other big guys. The reason for that being that I will not include artificial ingredients whatsoever in the food I sell. That means that my food is more expensive and the people that buy it are the people that would want to be preparing food for their dogs but don't have the time. I also give advice on supplements etc., to be included in a home prepared diet. I do that FOC!! What annoys me is that I have often recommended Burns to people who want to feed naturally, believing that I am recommending a good, wholesome complete food. I now find out that the food is far from that. How would you feel? Additionally, I would never ever lead my customers to believe that the food I was offering was 100% natural, when I know that it's not!!! That is why I will never be rich but I do what I do for the benefit of dogs.

Feed your dog what you like but please don;t make insinuations that I have a vested interest. The only interest I have is to see the consumer get a fair deal. That isn't happening here!!!

For your information. I am a member of lots of dog forums and mostly everyone knows what I do in my spare time. However, they also know that I would never use such a forum to promote my small business. The reason I have joined in this discussion is because I have a vast amount of experience in this area and I do know what I am talking about - so I think my input is pretty valuable here!!!!!

Kind regards
Annie

You're input in extremely valuable here....I'm pleased that you have posted your thoughts.Thanks

Thank you. Why does everyone always have to think that people have an ulterior motive in everything they do? I would definitely have a vested interest in this topic if I owned pedigree, james wellbeloved, natural dog food co etc., but I don't and I personally don't believe in dry food for dogs. Its not natural and it has brought about lots and lots of health conditions in dogs that were hardly seen before its invention. There are more dogs now suffering from bloat, gastric torsion, anal gland problems, bad breath ........ and the list goes on. Why? Because the pet food manufacturers would lead us to believe that dry food is the best. THe best food for your dog is a variety of meat, veg, natural vitamins and minerals, rice, oats, etc., - not something that is dry and sits in your cupboard for more than a year!!!! (eek!!!!)

I would never feed children a meal that I didn't know what was in it, why on earth would I want to feed my beloved dogs? I have to say too that the statement about crufts winners being fed on Burns is a bit like saying crufts winners are fed on pedigree. There are the same amount of dogs that are winning in the show ring that are fed on BARF, home prepared, pedigree, JWB as there are fed on Burns. The fact of the matter is that every owner thinks they are feeding their dogs on the best food. Once you actually find out what goes into food you then take a step back and think twice!!!! Vitamin K3 is not needed as a vitamin in any dog food. It is used to help the blood clot. It can also have very serious effects if used over a period of time. An ingredient like this has no place in food - be it for human or animal consumption!! Would you not agree?

Annie

PS: I'd also like to say that there is no need for your dog to get all the vitamins and minerals it needs in every meal. As long as the balance is maintained over a period of a month your dog will remain healthy. I don't sit down every night to a meal with all the correct balance - does anyone else? Why should a dog have to? There is no rocket science to feeding your dog a natural diet - it just takes a bit longer than emptying a cupful of food into a bowl!!!!!

I use Burns and will continue to do so. Burns offer a full list of all ingredients on their website. They do not have to print out all vitamins and minerals onto packing as it is not required by law, but it's easy enough to find on their website:

This is a list of the vits and mins currently in Burns:
Linoleic acid
Omega 6 fatty acids
Omega 3 fatty acids
Vitamin A
Vitamin D3
Vitamin E
Vitamin K3 (to be removed from early August)
Vitamin B1
Vitamin B2
Vitamin B6
Viatmin B12
Vitamin C (only in dog food)
Biotin
Folic Acid
Niacin
Pantothenate
Choline chloride
Calcium
Phosphorus
Potassium
Sodium
Chloride
Magnesium
Sulphur
Zinc
Copper
Manganese
Iron
Iodine
Selenium
Inositol (only in the cat food)
Amino Acids
Arginine
Methionine
Cystine
Lysine
Tryptophan
Threonine
Taurine (only in the cat food)

The only way you know 100% what is in your dogs food is if you kill a cow/lamb/chicken and feed it to your dog yourself and most of us don't want to do that. Every complete food is processed by someone else. The vast majority of commercial dog foods are far worse than Burns, but like Mini has said, certain things HAVE to be added to keep the food from just rotting away in the packet.

So Mr Burns has said they will now remove the Menadione, but i'm sure that futher down the line someone else will then come out with a complaint about another ingredient. There are always scaremongers, I could list 100's just in human food. If you believed them all we shouldn't really eat anything

Unfortunately i have found that not only sintetic vitamin K3 is used by Burns, but also a vitamin E is cheap and sintetic !
They use dl-alpha tocopharyl acetate
This maybe be a good preservative but not have tha same healthy effects compared to natural tocopherol found in other brand or in natural fresh ingredients.