Yes and I am sure you, like me, have seen the devastating results when people have taken dogs home which should have been PTS.

This is especially true of some of the "small" rescue homes, usually run by one misguided individual who believes that no dog should ever be PTS but who has not got the relevant skills, knowledge, ability, training or experience to determine how dangerous the dog in their care actually is.

Then another poor misguided individual (with the best intentions) decides that they can "cure" this dog, again without the requisite SKATE.

At best, the dog goes back to be recycled, at worst it does some serious damage either to the new owner, another dog or person and gets PTS eventually (after numerous reasons have been offered to excuse its behaviour) either there, or, after it has been recycled a few times.

Fortunately most of these have now been eradicated.

Whether or not a person has the best INTENTIONS or not, is irrelevant when the IMPACT of their decisions is the same as if they actually deliberately chose to place a dangerous dog in an inappropriate home.

Fortunately (or unfortunately depending upon your point of view) because the VAST majority of rescue dogs have no problems or have problems which are easy to sort out, most people are never exposed to some of the more "extreme" dogs and thus believe that all dogs can be rehomed/cured etc.

Rune I agree with this, and we all know there are precious few situations or real homes for some dogs (the problem dogs).

Wys
x

But...
would you seriously do this test then put your hand on your heart and tell prospective owners the dog will be fine if they want to take things off him? Really?
Because all the test does is provide the Rescue with an excuse if it goes pear-shaped.
Any dog can react. It depends on circumstances, not rubber hands.

I think we are all the same in that respect.

I try to stick to the topic rather than commenting on personalities, but we all succumb to temptation at times

No I would never tell prospective owner the dog will be fine if they wanted to take things off him.

That would be stupid because just because I could do it on a dog in a particular environment, does not mean anyone would else would be able to in another one.

For example my dogs are TRAINED to give up things, my GSD would not give up his ball for ANYONE other than me!

And the test does NOT provide rescue with an excuse if it goes pear shaped.

The whole POINT of the test is not "we have stuck a rubber hand in with the food, he has not bitten it so therefore you can take this dog home"

The POINT of the test is for INITIAL assessment when you have 30 dogs arrive at your facility, room for 20 and you have to decide which of the candidates are the most likely to be able to be rehomed with a bit of help.

Resources are not infiinite there is:

Not enough money
Not enough time
Not enough trained people
not enough space
not enough homes
not enough experienced owners

to rehabilitate ALL dogs.

So, selection has to take place.

It isn't for that---it is to help the rescue assess the dogs potential for guarding food. No one would ever say any dog is going to react in any way under any conditions----they would however say that it is likely the dog might react by showing aggression given certain situations.

Should that dog then be rehomed do you think?

I have very mixed feelings about it----my heart has often said give the dog a chance but my head has said what about the children who might be involved/ the grandparents who visit and are vulnerable/the kids friends running in and out---and any other people the dog comes into contact with.

I have mopped up too many tears when a dog has bitten badly and the whole family has been affected.

there are many many 'nice' dogs in rescue who would have liked that home. Very often they don't try again and that home is lost as well as any others in contact with them.

rune

And this is the part that many people do not think of; many are so affected that they NEVER have another dog again, so as rune says, that home, which COULD have potentially homed say 3 dogs over a lifetime, never want to revisit that place.

So 1 bad experience = 3 or more lost homes not to mention, as Rune says, those closely connected with the dog ie friends and relatives can also have their perspective coloured.

Yes totaly agree - it is so sad
But
The question in the thread is really is this a good way to assess?? I know there needs to be a method but is there ever going to be a 'one size fits all' way to tell with a dog

also hand on heart can anyone say they have not owned a dog who could possibly bite if in the wrong hands?

a good test would be to ask a potential owner to stick their hand in the food bowl - and if they tell the tester to get lost and let the dog enjoy its food then they can rehome

hi rune

yes i remember you saying that SS had done a workshop for the APDT before her first workshops she ever did at wood green

i went to the first wood green ones. we given to believe at the time they were her first.

but now i know this it does solve a mystery i had at the time.. i never understood why the APDT magazine were so vehement in their criticism of those that had made critique of SS after the wood green workshops.

i was chatting to the behavior section staff from battersea at the wood green one, we all felt that her tests were ok, but need moderating, as this wasnt new york with her stories of drug dealer trained killer rotties and pits that she stressed was her common experience, and we also felt her tests went too far the other way provoking behaviour probs in some dogs, and that some of the issues picked up could be rehab'd.

im not anti euthanasia in rescue by the way, im just anti the wood green/SS version.

her worskshop was poorly presented as well, she couldnt ge ther head around the objections.
which was silly...if you go to a foreign country and state that you kill 50% of the dogs in your own rescue and that every dog should be expected to put up with any provocation without being confrontational, you should expect to receive strong challenge and have prepared your presentation accordingly.

cool!