Was that the one with the dark dog on the left and Indy on the otherside?
Becky

no theres 3 of them, Quincey is Red & white, Wizard in middle is a red merle & then Indy.

The dark bitch was dilys, she was Indys fiancee, sadley she got run over whilst her owner was on honeymoon (run free Dil)

Well I must have seen it but can't remember which one.
Sorry to hear about Dil.
Becky

That is`nt what she said at all, I don`t understand how you got that idea

I really enjoyed this video - thanks very much for posting it!

Well I've just read through this lot !!!

I like HTM and I think it's an art of leadership, determination, good communication and teamwork. I didn't think this year's show was as good as previous years, I remember last year she had 4 dogs in the ring with her which was jaw dropping (IMO anyway )

As for the off topic stuff, my two penneth worth is this :

HD is not progressive. If you have a dog tested at 12 months and he is affected, he will be the same when tested at 12 years. It's not the same as Degenerative Hip problems and diseases.

As for breeding from Carriers of diseases, you have to sometimes in order to preserve a breed.

If these tests were available 100 years ago and everyone with every affected dog of whatever disease, then removed those dogs from the gene pools, many breeds today would no longer be here !

Even today, some breeds are so thin on the ground that to find a breed standard example that is completely free of everything within such a small gene pool, is terribly hard.

Is such cases, if every affected dog within a small gene pool was erradicated, leaving only poor examples etc, it would either erradicate the breed altogether or set them back decades with achieveing the breed standard again.

Breeding to better breeds often means making difficult decisions about using particular dogs that have outstanding benefits to a breed that cannot be ignored, if they have a known issue. You cannot ignore outstanding dogs, they are so very important in breeds which are disappearing.

As for those who only think clear dogs should be used regardless, at any cost, I hope you did all your research with your partners and thier families, and their respective families, and indeed your own, and questioned potential partners on their family diseases, and erradicated necessarily, before thinking of producing children !

Really !! These people do years of research to better breeds and preserve breeds, NOT save the world. If you really have a problem with diseases, donate all you have to the millions of charities for diseases and lobby the government to stump up more cash for HUMANS that are suffering !!

Now, as for the Coverage, I think this year was marginally better than last year, when I wanted to throttle the cameraman for sitting outside the NEC on most of the shots of Mary Ray

Great post Btw,

just wanted to pick this OT bit out to comment on!!!!

O/Topic alert!!!!!!

I always presummed(& id imagine Colliemad was thinking along the same lines as me) that say ypou had your dog scored at say 18months & it had HD of say 25-35=60 , Thats with high scores on the "top two" things on the sheet & lots of smaller minor scores below because damage has already started to be done (because of the state of the top two things) -sorry really cant rember their names, i could find flynns to refresh my memory but dont want to get depressed!!! )

I pressummed then if you got the same dog done then, say 5 years later that the score would be higher due to more grinding down, & more boney scar tissue building up & more detiration of the lower things on the sheet.

Oh dear you have totally misunderstood the role of DNA testing in Border Collies

Just had my three DNA tested they are all clear except that Rjj is a CEA carrier-he does NOT have CEA & therefore live a totally normal life. The other two(along with Wukee's litter sister Daisy-Mae)are clear for all the DNA conditions that there are tests for & I have blood in storage at Oprigen for when they get a test for PRA.

I would not breed from a TNS or CL carrier as these two conditions are lethal & do need to be eradicated. However CEA is not such a condition & some dogs are even affected, but go right after 12 weeks so are clinically normal. I would consider using a CEA carrier on my bitch as she is DNA clear & the puppies can be DNA tested at an early age(expensive but worth it)

The DNA tests for Border Collie, mean that outstanding dogs like Blwch Hemp(CEA carrier)are not lost to the ISDS dogs & wisely the ISDS have agreed to register offspring from him & his offspring late on the condition that they are DNA tested normal or carrier. the ISDS will not register puppies from a carrier(even if put to a normal partner)until the puppies are DNA tested & their status known.

To lose some of the dogs & their offsping from the gene pool would(in the opinion of genetics experts)result in a serious narrowing of the gene pool & the increase in known DNA conditions for which there is no DNA test(epilepsy & deafness for example)& possibly the discovery of other serious life threatening genetic conditions.

It would be pointless to bring in dogs from abroad to widen the gene pool as they all go back to the dogs of the 1920's when there were no clinical tests let alone DNA tests. In fact some "foreign"lines are so closely bred off the pedigree that they would/have little to offer in the expanion of the gene pool

The role of the CEA DNA test should be to prevent affected dogs being borne, not just eradicating the condition

Thats your opinion Dyane. I KNOW dogs that carriers do NOT exhibit the disease, its exactly the same with most diseases in that manner, Like VWD for example) however, my choice would be (given the size of many breeds now) to use only clear dogs, that way, at least for my peace of mind, Id have a "clear" line. What others choose to do is entirely up to them!

top two "things are the norberg angle and subluxation I did clarify what I meant and I was referring to the joint deteriorating due to athritis which a lot of dogs develop as a result of dysplasia. HD and PRA can affect a dogs quality of life, CEA in it's mildest form does not which is what I was trying to say

I think the score would be higher but that would be due to secondary factors as a result of HD not because the HD had actually progressed as such.