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Murf
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19-04-2012, 11:33 AM
One of the reasons we went for full castration was the fact ozzie would get sunburnt testicles.:O
And neither me or the wife wanted to suncream them lol
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Jenny
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19-04-2012, 11:33 AM
Originally Posted by Loki's mum View Post
My boy has the Suprerolin implant. I've found it brilliant. All the male behaviours that are undesirable are gone or very much reduced. There are no reported side affects either, so I'm happy it's safe for him. He lives happily with two entire bitches.
It is Superlorin that my two have had, and it's great that you and others here also have positive experiences with it.

As for the reduction in ball size, that's not a problem to me (not sure the dogs will notice themselves ). Apparently you can still show a dog who has had this implant as their balls are still present, even if they are smaller.
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smokeybear
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19-04-2012, 11:37 AM
Originally Posted by Tass View Post
I would agree about the increased risk of osteosarcoma, particularly in large breeds, but it is my understanding that neutering reduced the incidence of prostate cancer as there is less testosterone to stimulate the prostate gland and thus the prostate cancer risk is reduced. In fact castration is a treatment route for prostate cancer.
Tass my notes from Nick Thompson seminar:

Prostate Cancer

Usually malignant and the incidence of it increased by 4 x in MN; it equates to 0.6% to 2.4% morbidity in ME to MN.
Initially androgen dependent, later independent

1987 study by Obradovich “castration at any age has no sparing effect on risk of PC”


Studies in last 10 years show 3 x risk of PC in castrated dogs

Teske 2002, Sarenmo 2003, Bryan 2007

Breeds at increased risk of developing PC Bryan 2007 - Mongrels, Sheltie, Scotte, Westie, Beagle, ESS, GSP
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Loki's mum
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19-04-2012, 11:55 AM
Originally Posted by jenny.g View Post
It is Superlorin that my two have had, and it's great that you and others here also have positive experiences with it.

As for the reduction in ball size, that's not a problem to me (not sure the dogs will notice themselves ). Apparently you can still show a dog who has had this implant as their balls are still present, even if they are smaller.
You can show them but not all judges are aware of the effects of the implant, so you may have to mention it. I showed my boy at our club limit show last year and when the judge went over him, he got to checking his testicles and just stopped - he then said to me 'he's got little balls for a big lad hasn't he?' Ever so slightly embarrassing!!!!! He still won his class though!
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Borderdawn
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19-04-2012, 12:31 PM
Two of my males are on their third suprelorin implant. Its excellent and they remain totally unchanged in every respect except the girls in season are just not fanciable!
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Tass
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19-04-2012, 02:13 PM
Originally Posted by smokeybear View Post
Tass my notes from Nick Thompson seminar:

Prostate Cancer

Usually malignant and the incidence of it increased by 4 x in MN; it equates to 0.6% to 2.4% morbidity in ME to MN.
Initially androgen dependent, later independent

1987 study by Obradovich “castration at any age has no sparing effect on risk of PC”


Studies in last 10 years show 3 x risk of PC in castrated dogs

Teske 2002, Sarenmo 2003, Bryan 2007

Breeds at increased risk of developing PC Bryan 2007 - Mongrels, Sheltie, Scotte, Westie, Beagle, ESS, GSP
That’s very interesting SB.

Thank you for the information and references.

Having now just done some more research, I find that some of the research suggests that earlier studies saying castration reduces the incidence of prostate cancer may have come to that conclusion due to not using age-related controls.

Teske says that castration doesn’t cause it, but allows greater tumour development :

The interval between castration and onset of prostatic problems was highly variable, suggesting that castration does not initiate the development of PCA in the dog, but it does favour tumor progression.


Teske also identifies the Bouvier as being a breed at greater risk. I couldn't locate the Bryan breed specific work which would no doubt have also been interesting.

Sorenmo however does give an increased risk factor of ~x4 for castrated males with most canine prostate tumours being of non androgen-induced ductal origin rather than glandular cell origin.

Interestingly Sorenmo also states that because of this “Canine prostate cancer may, therefore, not be a realistic model for the human disease”. (In humans castration is considered as one treatment option, to at least alleviate symptoms).

As far as I can see, in the Obradovish study the castrated dogs presented had been castrated in response to already showing symptoms of presumed prostatic disease (which, with hindsight, may have actually been early indication of pancreatic cancer?) which would account for the statement that castration does not spare a dog from prostate cancer, (nor appears to have been an effective treatment) with, rightly in the circumstances, no comment made on it presenting a decreasing or increasing risk.


I shall update my mental information files and my risk:benefit calculations accordingly.
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Jenny
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19-04-2012, 04:04 PM
Thanks to you all for the comments Also thanks Smokey Bear for the link - very interesting!!

Loki'sMum - the comment from the judge when you were at show just made me laugh out loud (small balls for a big dog)

Borderdawn - that's great news about your two males being on their third implant.

How soon did any of you notice a difference in the boyish behaviour?
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Borderdawn
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19-04-2012, 06:29 PM
Originally Posted by jenny.g View Post
Thanks to you all for the comments Also thanks Smokey Bear for the link - very interesting!!

Loki'sMum - the comment from the judge when you were at show just made me laugh out loud (small balls for a big dog)

Borderdawn - that's great news about your two males being on their third implant.

How soon did any of you notice a difference in the boyish behaviour?
There is no difference to be honest, except they are not bothered about the bitches in season. They still cock their leg up, still do and act every way they did before. Its perfect really, it did what it said on the tin!

I expect it may have other effects on some dogs but a normal well balanced dog, it appears to do just as you want.
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Paxtonpup
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19-04-2012, 06:43 PM
Originally Posted by Murf View Post
One of the reasons we went for full castration was the fact ozzie would get sunburnt testicles.:O
And neither me or the wife wanted to suncream them lol


Not sure i'd fancy that either, does Ozzie spend a lot of time lying on his back? It seems to be Paxtons favorite position, no sense of dignity!
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