good on you novavizz for putting this up hopefully this will be the end to this thread its gotten way out of hand now and i agree these collars are a cruel sick way of training your dog and i would never use one myself its a torture treatment as far as im concerned

I agree, I love my dogs and would never inflict this on any of them. I won't get drawn into this repeat of the last thread about this subject although it has made interesting reading. My opinion has not been altered - I still would not use one - end of.

Mistake post

Blue Merl
are a cruel sick way of training your dog and i would never use one myself its a torture treatment as far as im concerned

Clob (Denis)
I aggree your entitled to your opinion and in fact there are a minority on here who seem to agree with you.

I find it unfortunate that you form an opinion without exprience as that invalidates any crediblity and maintains your opinion as a verbalised emotional reaction to a pyschological state and unrelated to any factual data of any kind on e-collars.

like i said before its a cruel sick way of training any dog there is no need to shock a dog to make it do things there are loads of other ways that the owner and dog can achieve in training without causing distress to the poor dog.no i havent used one of the torture collars and thats what they are and i never intend on using one

Scientific test commencing :

I find it unfortunate that you try to propogate an opinion without apparent experience of canine psyche as that invalidates any credibility you think you have and maintains our opinions that your verbalised emotional reactions from your apparent psychological state are unrelated to any factual dogs.

Test ends.


Findings :

Dictionaries, books on psychology, and E-collar propaganda leaflets [ aka Instruction sheets ], are definately not as tasty as soup.

Okay ... I would not find it easy to flick the switch on a death row prisoner, regardless of the crime. Hmmm is that a "verbalised emotional reaction to a pyschological state and unrelated to any factual data of any kind on death row prisoners" or is it simply because I do not think I would find it easy to inflict death on another human being?

Your point is complete rubbish. Believe it or not there are those of us who would find it abhorent to inflict pain or discomfort to another living creature, particularly when we KNOW there are better ways that maintain the love and respect we have with our dogs.

Lucky Star
when we KNOW there are better ways that maintain the love and respect we have with our dogs.

Clob (Denis)
Yes the couple spent enough money on “better ways” only to have the dog positively reinforcing the behaviour they specifically called in the behaviourist to show them how to change it and which ended up with the dog on the brink of death.

AND both the owners were very good learners, either one of them would come very high on my list of the easiest to teach and most dedicated to the task I have ever had.

It seems these kennel club accredited Instructors in dog training and behaviour aren’t all they would have people believe.

So the behaviourists were Kennel Club accredited????

There are very few Kennel Club accredited trainers or behaviourists. Perhaps your client would like to check her with the Kennel Club to make sure that they are indeed accredited and that this isn't just another supposition

Oh Gawd you will go on all night, won't you?

Where did I ever mention "kennel club accredited Instructors in dog training and behaviour - I DIDN'T (that's electronic shouting btw).

My dog isn't human perfect - far from it - but he is unique and I think that because I TRY to understand him and work with him, even I, at 5 feet 3 inches manage to handle him WITHOUT xs force or cruelty or pain. I get frustrated at times but that is me. I am not perfect but I believe my dog tries to understand my requests, I try to understand him and we rub along reasonably well together and forgive our relative inadequacies.

I PROMISE you (and any other owner with a dog similar to mine will agree) - stick a pain-inducing device on my dog and you will have a rebellion on your hands. He might INITIALLY comply because you keep zapping him (or however you like to dress it up) but he will remember ... and you will NOT have a good-natured dog on your hands in the long run. You will turn him into a miserable, sulky and possibly devious dog. No way would I do that to him and if you think intelligent, confident dogs respond to this you do not understand them.

Sure it would be great if he would like other dogs or not want to eat pigeons and hunt rabbits but he has natural urges and no pain induced methods are going to work on him because he is as he is. He is a wonderful, full-on, up-and-at-'em dog and I would not change him. All I would change is my own patience limits and limits of indulgence and understanding. But somehow I feel this is lost on you.

So all I can say to anyone reading this is

DON'T BUY INTO THIS E-COLLAR STUFF!