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Location: England
Joined: Nov 2007
Posts: 174
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30-10-2008, 01:09 PM
Originally Posted by melzy 
if your so right an wereso wrong WHY IS IT BANNED ???????!!!
The price of their support was the banning of hunting which was a lifetime career aim of certain backbenchers.
It was about politics, not animal welfare.
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Location: England
Joined: Nov 2007
Posts: 174
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30-10-2008, 01:12 PM
Originally Posted by red collar
Dog-fighting was mentioned, but we haven't sunk to mentioning badger-baiting yet.
Originally Posted by Helena54
I suppose these are the same types of people who would get pleasure out of watching badger baiting
In the very next post after mine
You see, these discussions follow a script after a while.
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Location: UK
Joined: Apr 2005
Posts: 13,122
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30-10-2008, 01:13 PM
Originally Posted by hades
Dont want to start an argument here...BUT can anyone who hunts or agrees with it, tell me what they actually get out of seeing a fox getting chased, ripped to shreds, shot etc?
Also where do you lot draw a line...badgers...deer...people paying money to go to africa to shoot big game????
I know most of us eat meat and thats fine...I see a clear reason for that animal being killed(for food) done humanly.
But to kill something for pleasure makes no sense to me...I cant understand it?
Don't get me wrong there will be people in all works of life who take a sadistic pleasure in cruelty to animals..
But in general those who follow country sports, and animal management will under stand and respect the reasoning behind the need to control animal population.
The hunting of fox/badger /deer , if done for population control , or the protection of live stock...I dont have an issue with..
Deer stalking is one I have some problems with... culling of deer if done by professionals with a quick clean kill I can deal with..what I dont like is those estates who run stalking weekends.. offering the chance to do the killing to the any tom , dick or harry with the money to pay for it, who usually are not good marksmen...leaving a wounded animal having to be tracked by the professional to finish him off.
I dont like big game hunting... for the same reason as above, breeding loins for the purpose of allowing someone to shoot them for big money fills me with revulsion.
Some many say I am hypercritical, so be it... those are the lines I draw!!
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Joined: Apr 2005
Posts: 1,724
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30-10-2008, 01:25 PM
Originally Posted by Jackbox
I can only speak for myself, it all boils down to animal control not pleasure...
Plus you also state that the foxes being chased over the field are not the ones killed so again
Why chase them if its all about controlling fox populations and not fun?
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Location: South East UK
Joined: Mar 2005
Posts: 27,437
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30-10-2008, 01:25 PM
Originally Posted by red collar
lol .... I KNEW it was bound to come!
In the very next post after mine
You see, these discussions follow a script after a while.
I suppose from my pov it's only because I've seen/heard what I don't like to hear, and yes,hands up to the fact that I love all furry creatures and have a problem with the WAY in which they are culled/killed. If we were rife with foxes (which we aren't!) and if they were causing loads of problems (which they aren't!) then I'm all for a cull should it be deemed necessary, and I want it done in the most humane way possible, just like the deer are culled, sharp and cleanly by an expert. These animals are doing no harm to ME, I don't have rabbits, chickens or sheep come to that, and when you look at it closely, it's only a very small minority of peops who ARE having a problem with the foxes, and these can be fixed can they not?! That doesn't mean killing the fox though, not just yet, their numbers are NOT causing big problems throughout the whole country, it's like a drop in the ocean, just like other things that cause different peops different problems, but we don't go around shooting or chasing at will to end that problem, we look for a fix TO the problem at source, i.e. put your chickens away, put your food in proper bins, keep your sheep well managed, and as for those game birds, well I have no answer to that one!
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Location: U.K
Joined: Jul 2007
Posts: 1,977
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30-10-2008, 01:28 PM
Originally Posted by red collar
Some societies are described as 'hunter/gatherers'.
What I'm saying is that maybe not every individual member of that society was a hunter and a gatherer. Maybe people specialised in one or the other because of a predisposition in their make-up.
I would be a hunter and you (presumably) would be a gatherer.
Have you noticed how most of these societies eat almost if not everything of the animal that is edible and do not waste anything...that is for survival!
They do NOT kill or hunt for fun!!!!!
So that theory holds no weight to me.
Originally Posted by Helena54
I suppose these are the same types of people who would get pleasure out of watching badger baiting, stallion fights as recently seen on Sky News, along with (as told to my by a well known tv wildlife photographer only 2 weeks ago), the people who would pay hundreds of thousands of pounds to be able to shoot a white lion
THESE are the types of people Hades, if you can get your head around them!!! Verging on the insane imo!!! Vermin or NOT, any animal is sacred to me (except rats and spiders!).Considering anybody I know (including Alice & Dogs On here) that has hunted themselves (and that includes me many moons ago though!) not one of us has actually killed a fox. I know of only one case where I left early, and there was a bit of a chase on, but nothing caught, so I fail to see how the banning of hunting has had any effect whatsoever on the population of the fox. Far more ARE killed on the roads, I see them every single day on the main road alongside my village, even badgers sad as it is for me to drive past, they are always there on the roadside
This is enough "control" and culling that I need to see. As I said before, the only people who seem to have a problem with the poor old fox are the people who don't keep their chickens/rabbits etc. totally secure as they should, and probably some sheep farmers who like Moobli said do not have such good
husbandry contols over them. Not forgetting of course, the gamekeepers in charge of raising those game birds so that other people can have an enjoyable day blowing their brains out! For me, they are the WORST of the worst for laying those horrendous traps, even the illegal poison, I've seen it for myself on the farm where I kept the horse, and where my poor dog ate some poison bait they had left near my field, coz it just happened to be the next field along from the woodland they were raising their gamebirds!Grrrrr. These are the worst culprits of the lot!
I find it very strange to be honest!
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Location: Scotland
Joined: Nov 2005
Posts: 19,298
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30-10-2008, 01:29 PM
Originally Posted by Jackbox
I can only speak for myself, it all boils down to animal control not pleasure...
Don't get me wrong there will be people in all works of life who take a sadistic pleasure in cruelty to animals..
But in general those who follow country sports, and animal management will under stand and respect the reasoning behind the need to control animal population.
I don't agree it is an efficient method of fox control. However, as I have said a few times already in this thread, I do feel foxes are now getting an even rougher deal than when hunting was legal, as they are being shot, trapped, snared and gassed by every tom, dick and harry now
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Location: Runcorn Cheshire UK
Joined: May 2008
Posts: 4,480
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30-10-2008, 01:33 PM
Originally Posted by red collar
because Tony Blair needed the support of his backbenchers to go to war in Iraq.
The price of their support was the banning of hunting which was a lifetime career aim of certain backbenchers.
It was about politics, not animal welfare.
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