Shona, your siggy line says 'if you cant rescue, dont breed'
So you have standards, that might be offensive to someone who has different standards

I have never said 'dont breed' to you or anyone. I have said what my standards are

The fact you do rescue shows that you are aware of the problem
There are not enough homes for all the dogs their are out there
Unless a breeder can say hands on heart that everyone who got a pup from them would not have got a dog from someone else then the pup produced takes up a space in a home that another dog would have taken

Yes I suppose you could say their are not that many rotties in rescue - but some people would have got a different dog if there wasnt enough rotties
I know nothing about you or anyone elses breeding ethics except what you all post on here so I do not condem anyone
I am just putting forward my beliefs
If you know of the problem, have thought tru all the options and are happy with your ethics then how can my beliefs make you sad??

Its not a nice when someone says that Im responsible for the death of dogs in rescue!

I thought sad was a better word to use than upset/angry or whatever.

ETA: if all the people who are responsible for dogs ending up in rescue, stopped what they were doing, rescue was no longer needed { I know a bit of a pipe dream, } but if that was the case, then only caring, responsible breeders were left, what would you do in future when ben and Mia are no longer here? would you go to a breeder?

I am not adding to the rescue system, my pups are in great homes, its the diddys that breed any rott to anything that looks vaguely like a rott that fall short in my book, those are the ones causing most upset for me.

when you say someone else do you mean another breeder? or do you mean rescue?

there are a few, but they are not bred by me.

they would have no choice would they? Im sure they would find another mastiff type breeder or similar to fill there needs.

but your making statements which imply Im killing dogs in rescue! when in fact I have saved more rescue dogs that you, I have saved more in numbers over the years than I have ever produced pups.
fair enough, but I do think your a bit one sided on this.

If there were no dogs in rescue I would be more than happy to go to a breeder, and I wouldnt have such high standards for a breeder - because at the moment I feel as their isnt enough space then their should be a blooming good reason for bringing another pup into the world

Why do you feel breeders should rescue?? If you are sure you are not in any way responsible for the dogs in rescue then why demand that breeders rescue??

I think its funny that I have been talking in general terms yet people take mamoth offence - wheras I have had my dogs personally attacked (called badly bred mutts who are too pretty and killing the ugly black dogs) and thats OK

For many many diffrent reasons, I have always been pro-rescue, even before I started breeding, in fact only one of my dogs was bought from a breeder prior to getting into rotties,
the rest were all lost causes from rescue with serious aggression problems {bless them}
After getting into rotties I felt it important to rescue for lots of reasons,
1} If people really love a breed, they will do anything in there power to help that breed, even if they didnt breed it.
2} Rotties are better coming to people who know and understand the breed
3} some rescue centres are very wary of placing rotties and some will PTS rotties rather than re-home, { A huge problem a few years back when there rep was at an all time low
4} we have more contacts of people intrested in the breed, so can place them quicker in suitable homes,
5} are better able to assess them than people who dont have as much hands on with the breed than us.
and the most important one is. I LOVE THEM.
I could go on and on with reasons, just as im sure you could.

Wow I can't believe this thread has come so far and is so off topic!! I thought it was about 'designer' dogs with ancy fancy names??
Where does rescue v breeders come into that? Unless it is because alot of these 'designer' breeders are usually byb or p/f...?
I am selfish I suppose, I have 3 dogs I bought from breeders and I don't show or do agility with or work, I didn't rescue... why? Because I have indoor guinea pigs and indoor rabbits and they had to come first, so I wanted a puppy to grow up with them. I got Jamie, he came from a breeder who asked alot of questions and came to my house and who I signed a contract with, so if I need to rehome Jamie, he goes back to him. Same with Deacon as it was the same breeder. I did ask about a ex racing grey, but because of the piggies and buns that was a no no. Most rescue won't rehome to me as I will not neuter my boys unless for health reasons. I got Codee, she was from a small breeder, again selfish to some, I wanted a puppy and I got her... But I asked English setter rescue before I got her and a greyhound place and a rescue place, the latter was the neutering issue, the second the small animal problem and the first none available!
Maybe those who buy from a decent breeder are selfish and maybe I am responsible for a dog dying because I didn't home them... But I rehome unwanted guinea pigs and rabbits, some that have come from horrific situations like my last three, so that makes up a little for that penance.
I would like a rescue, but I will not give up my small animals or neuter my boys to have that dog, sorry.

But when you stay things like



Its a little more than expressing an opinion, when you know perfectly well that we have on this site some very good breeders who take all the precautions necessary to ensure their pups dotn end up in rescue.

You have high standards that good, but with one hand you are setting yours, and the other hand is condemning ALL the breeders here...as killers!!!


Now there are idealistic views and then there are completely bazaar ones .. how can anyone possible guarantee that if a buyer does not buy from them, they wont go else where....sorry that logic is completely unrealistic.



Yes you have , on this and other threads...

I dont think it can be any plainer than the above what you feel about breeders.

Yes, that should happen but until laws and legislation are put in place then it wont. As the situation currently is, people can abandon or kill a dog easily and never have to take responsibility. So if rescues were not here to take those dogs, then they would be abandoned or killed.

Jake was from the SSPCA.

Your post is irrelevant in what I was posting in reference to. My point was that someone (i think BD) said most rescue dogs were crossbreeds which I was disagreeing with (never mind the number of breed specific rescues with pedigrees).

Also, many people do not know about the jag to abort a litter and depending on the circumstances, they might not realise the dog is pregnant until it is too late.

those are set up by people in the breed, funded by people in the breed, such as myself, I think you will find they only take breed specific for a reason, that reason being they LOVE that breed, are dedicated to it, ergo they sort out there own problems, SO as NOT to place a burden on general rescue thus allowing more x breeds or any other breed not covered by them a place in rescue.

they wouldnt just start taking in any old dog if the breed they were responsible for stopped needing rescue.

there is the bigger picture than just the one person breeding

if one person didnt breed one litter of pups then the people who would have got them have to go to another breeder
in turn that will knock on to the other people who would have got from that other breeder and it goes on down the line

if supply (the number of dogs bred) exceeds the number of homes for them then dogs will have to be put to sleep

you have given some great reasons for YOU to rescue rotties, wheter you breed them or not
but your siggy is the sweeping statement that everyone who breeds should rescue, why?