Its quite frightening how snipey and racey some working type Labradors look. Absolutely nothing like the founders of the breed...which were bred with substance for a reason!

Modern working collies







Working collies of the past







Can someone please have a look for some show collies, as my connection is playing up (due to the gale force winds I think )

Didn;t exacly go looking...but here you go

The ones with extremely heavy coats will be held back IMO, but you tend to find those with seriously heavy coats have had the working instinct bred out of them anyway so you never find out!

The unexagerated show Springer is very close to the original dog, once you strip away the coat. That said a lot of show kennels now are moving away from excessive coat and back to moderate feathering. The ones from the continent tend to have a lot less coat generally as they use them for working far more than the UK does.

As much as I love Springers, the working type just doesn't do it for me. The majority look nothing like the original breed and it can be difficult to tell the difference between a full working Springer and cross. For me when I choose to own a pure breed I choose it because I like the look of that breed. No offence intended btw.

For me the ideal Springer is one that looks like the original breed but can still do a days work in the field. I want it all basically!

I'll post some pics tomorrow when I'm on the laptop as I'm on my phone at the mo.

ETA: Interestingly, the show Springer pic you posted is one belonging to a Finnish kennel whose dogs can both work and show!

Welsh are dual purpose but not sure for how much longer with the docking ban, they also havent changed much over the years if you look at the old Maud Earl prints there similar to now maybe there a little finer.

Contessa of Tregwillynm


Dyson

I know they can't be docked for Showing, but are there people that breed Welshies, purely for work??

Cocker Spaniels.
Working: less feathering, smaller ears, plain colours.
Leaner build, more variation in size.

That reason is now not a reason----not for those who breed them more snipey etc. They are working the dogs and have found that the type they are breeding works for them better than other types. Thus they breed them and the dog evolves.

Same with the short springers, it was explained to me why they prefer that shape and it makes sense. Of course some dogs that are shown can still do what the breed originated for, but they don't often do it as well as the dogs bred just for working.

rune

Thanks Tassle. Personally all the "fancier" colours don't really appeal to me, but nothing wrong with the way these dogs look. However, it would be interesting to see how many are interested in working sheep.

I don't have a problem with the way the majority of KC bred collies look, indeed there are some very attractive dogs, but the border collie should be about the instinct and working drives not just the look - and how many pure KC line dogs have that?

I must also try to find some examples of the AKC border collies - as some are really extreme, and it would definitely concern me if that "type" of dog became the norm over here.

I think that is a very good point. There must be some pure show line dogs that still have some deep-rooted desire/instinct for work, but I would imagine they are a more "diluted" version, and don't show the same drives as dogs with purely working dogs in their make-up.