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Kerryowner
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04-08-2011, 04:37 PM

New dog growling at old dog-should I intervene?

As some of you know we had a new dog come to stay yesterday. We hadn't planned to get a companion for Parker until the end of September but then we got the chance to have Bizzy, an 8 year old female Kerry that I know from 5 years ago when I did agility with Cherry as Bizzy was in the same class.

Things all went brilliantly when we met on the heath and when they came into the house together but there have been a few occasions when Bizzy just glares at Parker and stands stiffly and growls at him. Occasions have been as follows-

1) at my Mum's bungalow yesterday afternoon. Parker was lying on the settee and Bizzy was on the floor.

2) at my Mum's when Bizzy and Parker were both on the floor.

3) this afternoon in our bedroom when I was having an afternoon nap after walking both dogs (I have fibromyalgia and don't sleep at nights very well). Parker was lying on the bed and Bizzy was on the floor.

When this happened at my Mum's my Mum went a bit hysterical as she is quite a nervous sort of person and she said to me that Bizzy was the sort of dog that needed to be homed on her own and I wouldn't be able to keep her.
(My Mum is very negative and can be guaranteed to think of the worst possible scenario in any situation bless her!)

When Bizzy growls at Parker he growls back at her in the same sort of tone but doesn't tense his body like her and wags his tail (not stiffly). At my Mum's I had to intervene because I didn't want my Mum to get stressed so I took Bizzy by the collar, said "no" in a firm but calm tone of voice and removed her from the room for a minute before letting her back in. When she came back she was ok with Parker.

This afternoon when it happened I thought I would just see how things progressed and there was a lot of growling and Bizzy came close to Parker and stood over him with her head near his ear and stopped growling. He just growled but was lying down still and relaxed if that makes sense. After them both growling at each other for what seemed like a few minutes but was probably less, she settled down next to him on the bed, then jumped off and lay on the floor.

I am not overly concerned as I know she was rehomed because of her not getting on with the other dog in the household who was a bit of a wimp. She would bully him as he was a nervous dog anyway and very yappy, then he got attacked by a Weimeraner and is even more nervous so when she would go up to him he would break down into a fit of yapping and submit to her.

Parker is not the type of dog to submit to a dog his own size (she's actually quite a bit smaller) and he has superb social doggy skills and is good at reading body language and knowing what to do and he hasn't been stressed by her being in the house which is a good sign. They have been fine with feeding together and being in the back of the car together (in harnesses next to each other) and going for walks together.

Bizzy is dog-friendly when on walks apart from she doesn't like Collies when they do that "Collie eye stare" thing at her.

Please tell me if I am right to let Parker deal with this on his own and only intervene if she does escalate this behaviour or remove her when she starts growling at him?

She also has a little growl when she has a toy in her mouth and he walks past but he just ignores this.

I work part-time from 8.30-1.30 pm for 4 days a week and I am separating them when left just in case.

Sorry this is a long post-any ideas welcomed!
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Malka
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04-08-2011, 04:51 PM
It sounds to me as if they are both just trying to get used to each other. Bizzy also has to get used to a new home and Parker has to get used to a new companion who is not Cherry.

Give them a little bit of time as it is quite a big step for both of them.

Is Bizzy going to stay or is it just temporary? I do hope she is going to stay...
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Ben Mcfuzzylugs
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04-08-2011, 05:04 PM
I think you are right to keep them separate when you are not there

Is she tense when she growls? I know Mia has a whole range of growls and some of them are more 'grumps' - like there is no warning ment in there its more like 'grumble grumble grumble hes taking up too much space on the sofa, no fair I have to move to get some peace'
then there is the 'why arnt you playing with me?' grump

if it was me I would prob keep a really close eye on things and try and figure out what is going on - obviously you dont want things progressing to fights so if you are feeling tension between them getting worse then get someone in to help you asap
Make sure and watch BOTH of them like a hawk - Parker is on his home turf with a stranger in there - ontop of his world being turned upside down so he might be eyeballing her

When you figure out what is going to set them off you can figure how you want to deal with things

But of course there is hope, my mum often enough told me that Mia should be an only dog, her and Ben would never live happily together - but they adore each other now, Ben is deff her big brother, she bugs him, plays with him and looks up to him
For the first week she spent most of her time crated because things were so bad (attacking Ben on sight and having a total hissy fit if he was within sight of her)

So I would say take your time, spend lots of individual time with them and quality time together like taking them on walks together - but try and limit times where there could be clashes
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MarchHound
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04-08-2011, 05:28 PM
It doesnt sound too bad.....

Keep them apart when you're not there for now - you and Parker are only just getting to know Bizzy so you don't want them arguing when you are not there.

I think, if they were my dogs, I would probably 'distract' them if one of them growled, you know? Clap your hands, throw a toy, squeak a toy...... I dont know. Thats just what my gut instinct is telling me!

Theres bound to be a bit of disgruntlements to begin with!
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Kerryowner
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04-08-2011, 06:20 PM
Originally Posted by Malka View Post
It sounds to me as if they are both just trying to get used to each other. Bizzy also has to get used to a new home and Parker has to get used to a new companion who is not Cherry.

Give them a little bit of time as it is quite a big step for both of them.

Is Bizzy going to stay or is it just temporary? I do hope she is going to stay...
Yes she is going to stay as long as things don't escalate!

Originally Posted by Ben Mcfuzzylugs View Post
I think you are right to keep them separate when you are not there

Is she tense when she growls? I know Mia has a whole range of growls and some of them are more 'grumps' - like there is no warning ment in there its more like 'grumble grumble grumble hes taking up too much space on the sofa, no fair I have to move to get some peace'
then there is the 'why arnt you playing with me?' grump

if it was me I would prob keep a really close eye on things and try and figure out what is going on - obviously you dont want things progressing to fights so if you are feeling tension between them getting worse then get someone in to help you asap
Make sure and watch BOTH of them like a hawk - Parker is on his home turf with a stranger in there - ontop of his world being turned upside down so he might be eyeballing her

When you figure out what is going to set them off you can figure how you want to deal with things

But of course there is hope, my mum often enough told me that Mia should be an only dog, her and Ben would never live happily together - but they adore each other now, Ben is deff her big brother, she bugs him, plays with him and looks up to him
For the first week she spent most of her time crated because things were so bad (attacking Ben on sight and having a total hissy fit if he was within sight of her)

So I would say take your time, spend lots of individual time with them and quality time together like taking them on walks together - but try and limit times where there could be clashes
Thanks-didn't realise your dogs didn't get along together at first! I hadn't thought about Parker eyeballing her-I will watch out for that as the only dogs she doesn't like I have been told, are Collies when they do the "Collie eye" so if he is staring at her confrontationally that would set her off. She is tense when she is growling-he isn't.

Originally Posted by TeflonsShadow View Post
It doesnt sound too bad.....

Keep them apart when you're not there for now - you and Parker are only just getting to know Bizzy so you don't want them arguing when you are not there.

I think, if they were my dogs, I would probably 'distract' them if one of them growled, you know? Clap your hands, throw a toy, squeak a toy...... I dont know. Thats just what my gut instinct is telling me!

Theres bound to be a bit of disgruntlements to begin with!
Yes-I don't expect it all to be plain sailing! Good idea re the distraction. Will try this.
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MarchHound
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04-08-2011, 06:26 PM
And *ahem* still waiting for photos?? *huff*
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Kerryowner
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04-08-2011, 08:36 PM
Originally Posted by TeflonsShadow View Post
And *ahem* still waiting for photos?? *huff*
Sorry-will be picking up hubby from work at 10.30 so IF I remember........
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Kerryowner
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04-08-2011, 08:39 PM
Bizzy has done something even naughtier than growling at Parker tonight-she growled at me! I was brushing her which she didn't like even though I was doing it gently. I just told her "no" when she growled, and praised her when she stopped growling.

I think she has been rather spoilt and likes to have her own way.

I need to get her out of this before September when they will be going to be groomed at Easton College.

PS-just looked again at the blurb about her on "Poodles in need" website and definitely says "good at being groomed"! That's about as true as being told Cherry was dog-friendly when I got her! I know I am new to her but I could not imagine either Cherry or Parker growling at anyone.
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MarchHound
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04-08-2011, 09:03 PM
Hmm, hopefully its just because shes unsettled or something.
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ClaireandDaisy
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05-08-2011, 07:32 AM
A growl is a dog indicating that it is anxious. It has nothing to do with naughtiness. It is very simply a dog saying `I am stressed` about something.
So the growling is a good indication, not a bad one. Growling is far better than the next stage, which involves barking, lunging and snapping.
So please don`t tell the dog not to growl - simply help the dog solve the problem. In the case of closeness to the other dog, ask the new dog to move away or play a game to defuse the tension?
In the case of the grooming, consider what you are doing to cause the dog stress. Perhaps shorter sessions or a little more praise will make it a nicer experience for the dog?
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