The procedures are simple- if you feel you are being bullied you report it - the report button is on the right of the post you don`t like.
The Ignore option is so you don`t have to interact with people you disagree with. It`s great. And extremely satisfying.
I also find walking away from the PC for a while helps put things in perspective. .

Wys - as always I totaly agree.
Often in these thread I feel 'what is the point' but then I remember that there are more people reading than there are posting.
People can switch on their TV and see CM doing what he does and for the majority of the GP this is about all they see of dog training and because it is on TV then he must be 100% correct
They dont know better, they have nothing to compair it to and even if it dosent seem to sit 100% with them they think he must know so much better than them and so must be correct
It seems to make sense and so, even with all the warnings on the TV people use the things they see him do themselves. I have often seen people 'tssting' finger jabbing, claiming the space and even lifting strange dogs tails up because they have seen it on CM and so think they can 'help' other peoples dogs

I think it is great that on these forums there is a place for people to see a different point of view - that there are other ways to train

I am also so happy that on here the disscusions have caused some people to rethink what they think about dog training and move away from alpha type training.

I question when someone posts about using his methods not to ridicule them but to
1. Really understand what method was used - lots of people when questioned about using CM's methods do not actually use any of the methods I object to
2. Try and understand why they felt the behaviour was needed - what other methods had been used and why had they failed - and would there have been other ways to solve the problem
3. Try and understand if it worked, why it worked, I am really interested in dog behaviour and I like to not take things at face value
4. Give alternatives and explinations from my experience incase there is someone else there with the same problem who is thinking of using the same solution with no experience in the matter

I love these threads because I get to see some really usefull links and advice from some great minds on here - I learn so much on here


although a home next to where I grew up was charged for when children were having temper tantrums pinning them to the floor and sitting on them till they calmed down

Yes. The reason dogs are so easy to mistreat is that they will cheerfully lick the hand that beats them.

As Dr. Dunbar likes to say "We beat dogs because they are beatable" and he follows this by also noting that horses and people are equally beatable.

Why should they bad about providing factual, up to date, scientifically verifiable information to someone who holds these outdated ideas.

I imagine she would get the same reaction if she went to an astronomy forum and claimed that the geocentric model was the accurate one (she saw it on TV!!)

You are right, this is a one sided debate. The detractors of Millan have all the facts, all the evidence, all the studies, all the science. This leaves people like you with nothing to argue other than to claim you saw Millan do it, or that for some emotional reason you believe something to be so. If you are a fan of Millan then to you facts don't matter.

The Only Bully on Here is CM. That is a bully!!!!! Not a bunch of Girls who just want to be nice to the dogs!!!!!

Yes!!!!

It's sad Gemma feels she wants to leave but thats her choice. I think she'll miss out on all the other fun and friendly topics. I think debates like this are healthy, I've seen no bullying only people with opinions and concerns about methods that to many on here are plain dangerous. If it makes people think twice or re-evaluate their choice of training then that's great.

I resent the implication that I or others here may be a "sheep" for thinking this way. My opinion comes from first hand experience but also from reading links on here and hearing others opinions. If that does make me a sheep, then fine. I'm better off for it!

This is what i dont get.......

1. Anti CMers are only interested in dogs welfare, so if the Pro Cmers say they dont Roll, Kick, "bite" their dogs , Anti Cmers really have no issue with them

2. Pro CMers seem to think Anti CMers are implying they are dog Abusers because the Like CM. That is not the case (see above note 1)

Its (the two sides) Confused & Completly at X purposes.

We dont know people really so can "only" believe what they say, so if someone says they arent horrible to their dog, Pro or Anti CM i believe them.

However i do believe CM can be at times completly EVIL to dogs, so if you would do 100% of what he does in every circumstance then i would put you in his catorgory. But not everyone would feel that way, would probaley have a 50 /50 spilt.

If you like CM, what does a anti CMers opinion matter to you anyway?

It's not me who is being bullied here Petrina ... it's the wee lassy Gemma, who has left the site ! Clearly, she felt threatened and harassed, such that she has withdrawn her subscription or however else you should describe it.

I can quite easily understand this because, as I have said before, I was badly bullied as a youngster and as a young adult. The only way to deal with bullies is to smack 'em right in the kisser - metaphorically speaking of course!

You have asked me how I can support someone like CM. Quite easily, because you see, his methods were revolutionary for me when trying to establish a level of control with my old wolf cross, Hal, who was an entire alpha male, totally disobedient, with no desire whatsoever to please his owners. It is a very long story, and I do not want to go into the details, otherwise yet another anti-wolf rant will start up again for the umpteenth time, the thread will be locked, and that will be the end of it. For the sake of the discussion, just accept he was a wolf cross AND an alpha to boot (please no arguments either about the alpha/pack theory - save it for another thread!).

Following our purchase of a digital telly 3 or so years ago, I started to watch the Dog Whisperer. Was intrigued, and to my amazement after a very short period of time, I had me a reasonably obedient dog! After 9 years of disobedience and complete lack of a basic recall. I have a few issues with the guy, but on the whole CM's methods work, and for a pragmatist like myself, that's good enough for me. I hate the Illusion collar, I hate gadgets of any kind, and neither do I need them. I can walk Tai off lead past a flock of squawking chickens that have escaped onto the set aside from their owner's garden, and keep him walking to heel and under control. His manners are fantastic (they were appalling when we rescued him nearly 2 years ago now). I taught him to sit and wait for titbits or his evening meal within a few seconds, just using CM's calm assertive energy, claiming the space around the food. I have got to the stage now where I can leave the room for a few seconds, come back in and the food is still there.

I could go on for ever, everyone raves at how obedient Tai is, how well behaved. All thanks to CM.

Whoever said they had the monopoly on being bullied ! Yet again, a most extraordinary statement from you, Jackbox !

I merely pointed out that I know what it is like to be bullied, to be a victim. And because I was at boarding school, it meant I had no means of escape ... the bullying went on 24/7 for 6 weeks of every term, until half term, then started up again when I returned to school for the remaining 6 weeks. We had exeat Sundays when our parents would come and take us out for lunch, but that only meant a few hours respite.

I am not trying to play the victim here, to get sympathy or anything else, just merely stating facts.

So for you anti-CM'ers to insinuate that because myself, Gemma or CC support his methods somehow we are cruel and not interested in animal welfare, can hit home and at least some of the barbs will dig in to the flesh - metaphorically speaking again, of course.

Perhaps those more vociferous of you might like to think before making such sweeping statements, and then it would not have been necessary for Gemma to feel she had to leave.

I wonder if when you bought your digital TV and switched on , and instead of CM , you saw Turid Rugaas, or any other positive trainer.. on a daily basis, promoting there skills in dog training, would you have been sitting here telling us of the same good results you have achieved today... and singing their praise.