I suspect that when people start submitting ads for dogs and you wince as you read them, you might find it harder than you think to post those ads...

Also, unless there is somehow, some way of vetting both buyers and sellers, you will end up contributing to the problem. No offence meant, but you really will.

Agree with you completely it's not always bad breeders on these sites, like most, they just recognise that these sites are the ones that show up first when you are searching for puppies online.

That's a good point about fakes and scams - I don't really know much about that side of it so your help will be evaluable.

What kind of scams go on? Is it mainly 'puppies delivered'? Does anyone actually fall for that in this day and age? I think in the US they ship puppies more than here - or is it an old dying trend there too now?

Yes it will be free-ads, as that's the only way to compete with the current leaders in the field. We'll run google ads on it, and hopefully we'll be able to sponge on Dogsey's server as I can't imagine a 'classifieds' site using up too many resources tbh, it's not like it will have all of the functionality of forums. Well I'm hoping anyway

If we do manage to have any money left over, it will of course help with the development of the other pet site I often talk about (the one where we'll try to raise £1M).

Can you post a sample 'puppy shopping list' (just link to normal amazon items) in the general dog chat section please? Maybe we'll be able to add that to the site too (and it can help people here in the meantime)

I know what you mean there. I often see red when I see those ads - they make me so mad

But...

I don't think we will be 'adding' to the problem Tabitha, for the following reasons:

• We're not creating something new - just (hopefully) replacing the current sites run by less ethical owners.
  
• By doing that we will actually be able to lessen the negative impact - because we'll have a better message and tips on how to choose a good breeder, as well as being able to direct people to Dogsey, and of course to the new site where we raise money for charity. We'll have a voice reaching those people we wouldn't have had otherwise - I think that's the crux. As I mentioned earlier, to begin with we'll have to be subtle, and stealth - but in time we can turn up the heat. It won't be an overnight thing, but faster than not doing it to begin with - don't you think?

AZZ I totally admire your determination to do something about the problems, I really do.

I just worry that once the ads start coming in....

How will you feel when you know that your site - however well meant - is enabling people to:

- buy from puppy farms?
- buy from parents that are not health tested?
- buy dogs that they may then treat badly?

Because that is what will happen, and yes these sites exist already alas, so I'm just not sure that adding another one, no matter which other features you will include, is the answer

Surely what we need are more sites where reputable breeders and rescues can advertise?

E.G. a site where the breeders must prove they are adhering to some sort of minimum standard for health tests?

Otherwise, you will have a site which simply enables more puppies to be sold to unsuitable owners/by unethical breeders - and those puppies may well end up in rescue!

Yep will construct a little shopping list in a minute after taking the dog out - will invite others to contribute as there are far more experienced puppy owners out there than me!!

The Amazon Associates could just be a good way of earning extra revenue, especially if you are getting a lot of traffic - I have a site that includes them.. It would also be useful for dogsey too IMO, especially on your article pages or maybe on certain threads. You can place them like ads down the side of a page, so people click to purchase it, or use it like a hyperlink on a word or picture that leads to an amazon page.. the page includes your site name in the URL so registers any sales that have come direct from your site.

Aww thanks - that means a lot. xx

I completely agree with you Tabitha... it will make my blood boil. But I am stronger now - I'm back on my detox and feel a lot more like my old self. I think we can do it so long as we keep the end goal in mind, and the impact we will and might be able to have.

Plus it will be nice knowing we helped kill-off those sites run by unethical people, or at least put a big dent in them

I think I'm trying to look at it like this: what would I prefer?

A 'free-ad' type site owned and run by a person who doesn't give a toss about dogs, or one by one that does - and who has plans to help educate people and make a difference.

I just think we will be able to do a lot more good than them - and getting 'new' owners from the outset will not only help Dogsey (which in turn is good for ethical social attitudes) but will also help that site where we raise money for charity.

We can rest assured that we didn't create the problem - but are merely taking it on from others but importantly, trying to fix it as well.

As far as I know, nobody has ever tried to tackle the problem like this - that's kinda scary, but sortof gives us some hope too?

That was the plan for the Dogsey breeders directory. I can't really go into the details here (as it's still a possibility for the future - and I don't want other sites nicking the idea) but I sortof went of the idea for the following reasons:

• As it would incorporate a paid element, I really don't like the idea of going into a 'business' based on making money out of breeding, even though it would of course go towards helping develop that other site/doing other good.
  
• I think the time spent on it would be better spent on these other sites, the one mentioned in this thread and the one where we try to raise £1M for pet charities.

But definitely think it's worth doing in the future - in fact the designs for it were already done, but I'm just not feeling it right now for the reasons above.

Hopefully this thread has shown that we won't be adding to the problem (as it's not anything people can't and aren't doing at the mo) but by taking the bull by the horns, we will have more power and influence than even organisations such as the RSPCA has on these sites... because it will be self-regulated (albeit over time).

Am I am explaining it properly? It 'should' be sounding like a good idea but I can be a bit crap getting my thoughts down sometimes :/

Thanks that'll be great!

Once it's done perhaps we can move it to the articles sections - I shall ask Mini to help out too as she's very knowledgeable when it comes to puppies

I'm not too bothered about joining the affiliate scheme for Dogsey - but think it's a wonderful idea just to get that article up for new owners (Perhaps keep the links as amazon products so that we can easily port it to that new site tho )

As the site owner if any thing goes wrong with a sale ,someone gets scammed ,a puppy is sold and then becomes sick.will people not come after you as it was bought via your site??
Even though you had nothing to do with the actual sale..?

No. In the same way as if anyone takes advice imparted by members here on Dogsey - the views are those of the individual and not those of the site. And the new site will be like all the other selling-sites, they are just a medium for others to place ads - we're not selling anything ourselves.

Great, I have started it and posted in the section.. I haven't finished the links yet but got to get to the parents for Sunday Roast

Glad I have been of a little help, will be back to work on the links later, and add some more information about why the items are appropriate if it would possibly be posted as an article.