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Krusewalker
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12-02-2011, 01:46 PM
Originally Posted by ClaireandDaisy View Post
I understand what you`re saying - but I think you`re blaming the tool rather than the way it is used. Anyone who has ridden a horse knows how you can ruin one if you are insensitive with the reins. A hard-mouthed horse is a horrible ride. In the same way a ham-fisted rider can spoil a horse, a `yank and shout` merchant can misuse a collar.
That`s why you train a dog to walk with you, you don`t rely on a piece of kit.
Hi clair

objectively speaking, you can make the same point for check/choke chains.

proponents of these say the same as you just did, ie, they are meant for checking, not yank and pull (choke), thus its not the tool, but the way you use it.

the responding arguement would be, yes, very true, but some tools are designed in a way to make misuse...unintended or intended...easier to achieve.
its not just the yank and pull merchants, but the well meaning struggling unskilled stressed handler.

so in that sense, you can see why the arguements for neck damage fallout could apply to all neck based "slip and slide tools".

the similar principle of unskilled handler using tool that offers easier opportunity to cause injury applies to flxis when compared to long lines, for example
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Adam P
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12-02-2011, 01:59 PM
Still just a guess though isn't it!

Have you read the reference list of the article, pitiful.

Adam
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Krusewalker
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12-02-2011, 02:02 PM
Originally Posted by Adam Palmer View Post
Still just a guess though isn't it!

Have you read the reference list of the article, pitiful.

Adam
you mean as oposed to your oft used ref list: some old hostile weirdo whom came across as completely inhinged everytime he posted something?
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Sara
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12-02-2011, 02:14 PM
Originally Posted by Krusewalker View Post
you mean as oposed to your oft used ref list: some old hostile weirdo whom came across as completely inhinged everytime he posted something?

Good one Krusewalker
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Chris
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12-02-2011, 03:20 PM
Originally Posted by Adam Palmer View Post
Still just a guess though isn't it!

Have you read the reference list of the article, pitiful.

Adam
As yet, nobody can say exactly how the brain works and reacts or the exact workings of the sensory system in any animal, including humans. However, we know far more now than we have ever done and are learning more and more every day. For this reason, we adapt the way we respond to animals (or those who bother to take note do) so yes, no matter how qualified there is still an element of 'guestimate', but, of course, there are educated guestimates and uneducated guestimates. I'd put Karen Overall in a position to make very good and legitimate educated guestimates that are likely to be far more accurate than the theories put forward by those who put forward theories without a scientific basis for their logic.

Each new breakthrough in sensory knowledge points more and more to pain and discomfort being detrimental and often harmful
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Azz
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12-02-2011, 03:58 PM
Originally Posted by Adam Palmer View Post
Still just a guess though isn't it!

Have you read the reference list of the article, pitiful.

Adam
No it's not 'just' a guess.

It's an asserted theory based on real science.

The fact that you can't discern the difference is very worrying in itself.
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