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Location: Tayside
Joined: Nov 2009
Posts: 680
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12-12-2010, 09:35 AM
Originally Posted by Brierley 
Every behaviourist gets those cases and those calls, even the ones who study to get their degrees and they manage to pull out all the stops to ensure that their customers do not suffer. By implication, you are indeed decrying studying in this field by implying that anyone taking a degree (or other study) somehow lets people down who need their services. This doesn't have to be so and for many it isn't.
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Location: UK
Joined: May 2009
Posts: 709
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12-12-2010, 09:40 AM
Originally Posted by Brierley
Again, you decry education - 'reassurance of qualifications'.
Sorry, but your posts seem to indicate otherwise
Love it - so many assumptions. I don't know what degree your colleague is doing, but the one I am thinking of is distance learning. Attendance at college is two weekends and one week per year (that week being 4 days). Dogs go with you as you need your dog for the practical aspects of the course. Yes, of course, there are sacrifices when taking qualifications - usually social life, or watching TV etc goes on hold and that time is utilised for study - in other words free-time and we all (no matter how busy we like to think we are) have some of that.
When I make a statement saying "I do not decry education and I do respect those that follow that route", then what I actually mean is, " I do not decry education and I do respect those that follow that route ". Whatever you summise from that is your choice but it will not alter the facts.
MY Colleauge is doing the course you describe and she finds the time commitment difficult. Her dog has been lame for much of the last year and trianing him alone has therefore been a lot more challenging than she had expected. I have been involved with many of her assignments and therefore I am fully aware of how much time and effort is involved. I have also been one of her case studies for studying an instructor, so I do appreciate what is involved.
I respect that you have your view and I have mine and I am guessing that you yourself have felt the need to become educated to succeed at your chosen career? But that does not mean it is the "ONLY" way.
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Location: UK
Joined: May 2009
Posts: 709
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12-12-2010, 09:45 AM
Originally Posted by rune
Several DOZEN clubs set up by trainers you have trained-----blimey----you are a franchise!
rune
Yep several dozen Rune. Thats right. Remember I have been teaching professionally for a great number of years. At the moment there are nine of us. There have been a lot of us for many years. At any time, any of those can or might leave to set up their own training. And periodically they do. I also have a number of trainers come to me for training prior to their establishing their own clubs, to learn about business, teaching and dogs. I have also run instructors courses and have more planned. The numbers soon add up.
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Location: UK
Joined: May 2009
Posts: 709
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12-12-2010, 09:50 AM
Originally Posted by Brierley
It's always useful to know what lies behind behaviour and what lies behind the training that is being carried out. Understanding is a valuable tool in any trainers toolbox
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Location: UK
Joined: May 2009
Posts: 709
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12-12-2010, 09:52 AM
Originally Posted by TangoCharlie
Trouble is there are some trainers out there but they don't update their professional development. They have been doing it for 20, 30, 40 years and have never read a current book on dog training. Great experience, but as you know, things move on.
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Location: cornwall uk
Joined: Oct 2006
Posts: 7,132
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12-12-2010, 10:14 AM
In teaching mainstream children I rarely looked back at the psychological development and the sociology was really common sense. However when I moved into teaching children with profound physical and mental problems it became very important to know the norm and the different stages of learning and also to be able to understand the impact the children have on their families and the society around them.
Thus with dogs I believe. Teaching/training the mainstream dogs from pups is not rocket science. However taking on the problem dogs and trying to help them and their owners is a helped a lot by a basic knowledge of what makes them what they are (or should be). That is where book learning can come in useful----and is one way of proving you have that in depth knowledge is an academic qualification of some sort.
My thoughts.
rune
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Location: dullsville
Joined: Nov 2005
Posts: 4,241
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12-12-2010, 10:19 AM
Originally Posted by rune
Several DOZEN clubs set up by trainers you have trained-----blimey----you are a franchise!
rune
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Location: dullsville
Joined: Nov 2005
Posts: 4,241
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12-12-2010, 10:36 AM
Originally Posted by Brierley
I've found that people aren't interessted in the 'nitty gritty', more whether someone is qualified and if they recognised that qualification it carries weight
you misread that paragraph. the point was that their eyes glaze over when i mention all the courses and certificates and try to show them my file. that is me talking about my qualifications. whereas when i tell them all the places where i worked with dogs the conversartion flows.
as we said earlier, their is no officially recognised qualification in dog training
No one suggested they were. The 'objection', if you like, is when education is denegrated. No need for it. Those that don't wish to do courses have no obligation to do so at present, but those who do should be encouraged and applauded in their efforts (just my opinion of course)
i never denigrated education, i think i even said i have no problem with degrees, but i just dont think they are the be all and end all or necessarily the highest mark for judging a dog trainer. in even said i have done lots of education, and that even the education route doesnt necessarily have to equal a degree. like lotsadogs said, its odd how people on forums have this obsession that very dog trainer and/or behaviourist should be paper, or degree, qualified, when the average pet dog owner isnt so fussed.
that just appears to be an obsession with doggy forum people, but doggy forum people are only really representative of doggy forum people, not pet dog owners.
Nope, you need experience as well, but they are a good route if the course is demanding. It's always useful to know what lies behind behaviour and what lies behind the training that is being carried out. Understanding is a valuable tool in any trainers toolbox
So do I and I already said so several posts ago. You can attain that knowledge without doing a degree or gaining a certificate. In the same vein, its always useful that those that have done degree or equivalent courses have actually trained some dogs.....plenty havent...I have actually sorted out some dogs that BSc behaviorists were appalling around. One of theses behaviourists (charged loads of money) even admitted to me she had just started to become a trainee dog trainer at a club!
It would make your hair stand on end if i listed everything she said and did.
So it works both ways really.
That's an interesting thought. Could you expand a little?
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Location: dullsville
Joined: Nov 2005
Posts: 4,241
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12-12-2010, 10:38 AM
Originally Posted by rune
Denise. Do you want me to talk to you as well
?rune
. your post followed mine
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