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krlyr
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26-04-2012, 09:10 AM
Originally Posted by talassie View Post
I had forgotten until now about a walk with Steve where he took hold of my dog's line and without a word or move from him she changed from a wild beastie trying to get to every other dog around to a calm obedient dog He told me that this happened because his expectation of her was different to my expectation. I remember his mantra being 'patience and persistence (and perhaps something else???)'
But equally, my older brother has taken Casper for walks and not seen an ounce of his reactive behaviour - he's bumped into another dog walker, let the two dogs have a play, and come home and asked me why I walk him with a muzzle. My brother loves animals but he's certainly no dog behaviouris! Rather than him having a natural affinity with Casper, chances are that Casper is unsure of what to do when walked by someone different to usual and his normal reactions are surpressed - similar to how flooding can surpress a reactive dog's behaviour.
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waggytail
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26-04-2012, 09:18 AM
Sorry but I do have to say....in defence of ALL trainers/Behaviourists, that qualifications and membership to clubs and organisations does not automatically make you the best option for anyone needing professional help with their dogs!

I have commented on this issue before, I have seen good and bad in both camps, Some of the best trainers who have no formal qualifications as well as others who have been extremely academic but have no practical dog/people skills whatsoever

There are many different routes to becoming a good dog trainer or behaviourist and it is very unfair to judge. I recently saw a website that actually advised dog owners not to seek the help of anyone without certain qualifications, There are so many different courses and clubs these days and trainers should not be dismissed just because they do not hold certain papers not to mention the value of many years of practical experience they may have!

Steve, I look forward to watching your new TV show, I do hope it will be a fair and true representation of what you do (not easy on TV, as I'm sure other TV trainers will testify ?) Please let us know details and "Good luck"
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DoKhyi
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26-04-2012, 09:34 AM
Originally Posted by Jugsmalone View Post
[B]

I've also just undertaken the quiz and it appears my dogs are in charge of me too!

Im sorry but that quiz is total nonsense. Coles is 12 and Buster is 3. Neither have any behavioural problems whatsoever but yet they are in change of me
I was wondering if it was a loaded quiz and impossible to come to any other conclusion than your dogs being in charge, but most of my answers were no. Woot - my dogs are not in charge of me... shhh everybody, don't tell them!
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DoKhyi
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26-04-2012, 09:55 AM
Originally Posted by krlyr View Post
But equally, my older brother has taken Casper for walks and not seen an ounce of his reactive behaviour - he's bumped into another dog walker, let the two dogs have a play, and come home and asked me why I walk him with a muzzle. My brother loves animals but he's certainly no dog behaviouris! Rather than him having a natural affinity with Casper, chances are that Casper is unsure of what to do when walked by someone different to usual and his normal reactions are surpressed - similar to how flooding can surpress a reactive dog's behaviour.
I think you're right and you don't have to be a behaviourist to achieve that kind of thing. Maybe Caspar didn't react because your brother didn't expect him to do and Caspar picked up on him being relaxed and confident. It might change if Caspar had an off day on a walk with him though.

We used to have racing greyhounds and my mum wanted to have one of the retirees as a pet. He was a lovely dog, but my mum was very nervous of him reacting to anything, so he was a quivering wreck outside on walks. If I went with them and took the lead, it was like a switch flipped and he was a totally calm, confident and relaxed with me. My mum sadly couldn't get in that mindset with him. He went back to the kennels and lived his life out as the go to dog for pairing up with new dogs and keeping the lads company in the caravan.

I've also shocked more than one friend by trying to show them how to handle their seemingly mental dogs that they moan about. The dogs weren't the problem! One of the neighbours used to have two mental GSDs that dragged them round the streets on choke chains as they shouted at the dogs in frustration. They were wide eyed when I walked one to heel on a loose lead and had him sitting on command in literally 5 minutes. Sadly, they believed it was me that was some kind of dog guru rather than it being something anybody can do and went back to what they knew.
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Ben Mcfuzzylugs
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26-04-2012, 11:58 AM
Quite often a dog will behaive perfectly when a stranger takes hold of their lead - because they dont know them and they are trying to suss things out

a good trainer knows this and dosent get on a power trip about it
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Wysiwyg
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26-04-2012, 12:07 PM
Originally Posted by waggytail View Post
...

...There are many different routes to becoming a good dog trainer or behaviourist and it is very unfair to judge. I recently saw a website that actually advised dog owners not to seek the help of anyone without certain qualifications, There are so many different courses and clubs these days and trainers should not be dismissed just because they do not hold certain papers not to mention the value of many years of practical experience they may have!
There is a problem though, in that you can have someone who has been "in dogs" for 30 years and still use methods from when they first learned about dog training... by that I mean they may use the methods of Babs Woodhouse, as many of us used to do (but many of us moved on!). Some of these people are great, if they do keep up with new knowledge, and they have wonderful hands on experience of course, but sometimes they are just dinosaurs. How can the general public judge? It is hard for owners to know how to find someone reputable that won't harm their dog esp. when you take into account the Milgram Effect.

I like to be open minded, and I hope Steve's method is good for dogs and owners alike, but I am concerned that it may not be, to be honest.

Guess we will have to wait and see

Wys
x
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waggytail
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26-04-2012, 12:31 PM
Originally Posted by Wysiwyg View Post
There is a problem though, in that you can have someone who has been "in dogs" for 30 years and still use methods from when they first learned about dog training... by that I mean they may use the methods of Babs Woodhouse, as many of us used to do (but many of us moved on!). Some of these people are great, if they do keep up with new knowledge, and they have wonderful hands on experience of course, but sometimes they are just dinosaurs. How can the general public judge? It is hard for owners to know how to find someone reputable that won't harm their dog esp. when you take into account the Milgram Effect.

I like to be open minded, and I hope Steve's method is good for dogs and owners alike, but I am concerned that it may not be, to be honest.

Guess we will have to wait and see

Wys
x
Hi Wys,

I agree that it is hard for the general public to judge, Dog owners need to speak to potential trainers and ask questions in order to be reassured that this is the right trainer for them. I'm just saying that "letters after your name" are not a guarantee of anything.

Good trainers do keep up with new knowelege, perhaps more so if they are "Independant"

Courses and clubs can differ in ethics/principles also students/members do not always keep to the guidelines

I was told by an apdt trainer to hit my puppy on the nose for play-biting??
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Wysiwyg
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26-04-2012, 01:23 PM
Originally Posted by waggytail View Post
Hi Wys,

I agree that it is hard for the general public to judge, Dog owners need to speak to potential trainers and ask questions in order to be reassured that this is the right trainer for them. I'm just saying that "letters after your name" are not a guarantee of anything.

Good trainers do keep up with new knowelege, perhaps more so if they are "Independant"

Courses and clubs can differ in ethics/principles also students/members do not always keep to the guidelines

I was told by an apdt trainer to hit my puppy on the nose for play-biting??
Yes I understand what you are saying, I think the main thing is that every trainer/behaviourist takes steps to do some continued professional development, even if it's just reading up to date books or looking at a particular topic in real depth, or preferably some workshops (finances permitting ).

Shame about the trainer's advice, do you know if it was apdt uk or another apdt? Often they get mixed up.Were you able to let the organisation know about it?

Wys
x
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smokeybear
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26-04-2012, 01:25 PM
Yes I reported a member of the APDT for behaviour which was far from fair, kind and effective.
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muddymoodymoo
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26-04-2012, 08:14 PM
Originally Posted by talassie View Post

I think it is good to have an open mind and look at different ways of training.
Hear hear!
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