Max and Murphy were both done at about 8/9 months of age....

They were done in the traditional manner (furry plums off!) and were both fine...

Boxers tend not to have coat issues, but I can say that neither of my boys has changed in personality or manner since their ops.

They didn't really hump beforehand, and don't really hump now, so that hasn't been a worry.

I had them castrated as I felt it was the responsible thing to do, given that there are a lot of loose/roaming dogs in our area (rural location) and that their breeder (my best friend) has 3 unspeyed bitches (although that will soon change).

P.S. I have shown Murphy in KC open shows with a confirming letter, and had no trouble with it

You did indeed say that but you continued to address the rest of your post to me, i.e the part relating to, "as God intended".

I've never had a bitch so won't get involved in that particular discussion.

And I stand by that. There is nothing 'natural' about how pet dogs, or any pet animals for that matter, are kept. There is nothing natural about selective breeding. Thus I fail to understand that arguement.

The woolly coat thing isn't a myth, although it doesn't affect every dog. A friend has working cockers and ESS, and after spaying, her girls' coats went awful. The most dramatic change was in the cocker, who now has a fine, whispy, felty, short coat. It's really strange. These are all girls though, and I've been told it's more likely to affect spayed bitches, but I don't know how true that is.

Maybe we should compile some Woolly-Stats: just hassle every ESS owner you can find and do some research to see how common it is! Also, might Woody's breeder be able to put you in touch with any relatives that have been neutered? Might be a good indication of whether it'll affect the lad. Good luck whatever you decide.

For me personally it's because of the health benefits. My last Springer had a closed pyo in her old age due to not being bred from and not being spayed. It very nearly killed her as we unaware of the condition in those days. This would be my main reason for spaying a bitch along with the risk of mammary tumors (quite common in ESS from what I can gather). With male dogs the main health reason for castrating them is to prevent prostate cancer, but removing the nads won't prevent this as the prostate is still insitu as it were. It may well prevent testicular cancer, but from what I can remember this is a lot less common.

When I first joined here (many moons ago ) I was all for lopping off all genatalia from all dogs, but once you look through the old threads, listen to people that have been breeding dogs for many years and doing some research you start to realise that these are living breathing animals and lopping off their body parts should be seriously considered and not done "just because". Yes neutering prevents unwanted litters, but if you're the sort of person who is asking the question in the first place then I'm willing to be you're not irresponsible enough to have an accidental litter.

That's just my opinion anyway, no doubt someone will come along and tell me I'm wrong!

Well ... how about we chop off your personal bits - especially the ones that relate to hormones, etc.? See how you get on, eh?

You might not think it 'natural' that dogs live with us but they seem to fare pretty well and are creatures of comfort - a good meal, a kindly word, a warmish place to rest, etc. What would you have us do - chuck our dogs out in the cold to fend for themselves in the local park of a night?

I fail to see the link between the way pet dogs are kept (in terms of food, housekeeping and love) with the administration of drug products and major operations - one is non-invasive and the other invasive. And I really have no idea why you are bringing in selective breeding to the topic.

I would agree with however said it first, the coat change thing isn't a myth, but it doesn't necessarily effect every dog. Like I said, there are a few working ESS in the village that have been neutered and have suffered no ill effects re their coat. Interestingly though, they're all related!

I'm looking into "spay coat" as it can be called as I might aswell get Isla spayed now. It looks like it may be possible to control the coat with a coat king or furminator rather than resorting to clipping.....

Dogs don't turn around and think 'OMG, I miss my testicles!'.

And you can't compare dogs and people.

Neutering a male dog is NOT a major operation! spaying a bitch is far more invasive. Neutering is not.

There is no right or wrong answer and reading everyones opinions can often make it more confusing.

For me all mine have been done, 1 never humped before, never did after, 1 didnt before, did after and 1 didnt before and did a couple of weeks after.
I did it as I felt it was the responsable thing to do but fully understand if people choose not to, after all its personal choice. So at the end of the day its your choice and whatever you choose will be the right choice.

I'm on my 3rd neutered, male ESS and they have all been woolly. The current chap was clipped before he was rehomed with us, but he is looking a bit fuzzy as his coat grows. I heard recently that Evening Primrose Oil is supposed to help