Over Compensating

Hi

Did anyone catch the programme on 5 re dogs last night, the Authorities went in and grabbed all the dogs at this puppy farm,and they also managed to grab all puppies,they were on there own,But and this is a big but,and I have done it myself with Faye.

People already have a soft spot for puppiesbut if there is a tragic story to boot,instead of treating the puppy as normal and try to teach it boundaries,as no one knew how long the puppies had been without mum,but the vet thought it probably happened anywhere between 7and 8 weeks,we want to make it better,so we shower them with love,but forget that these dogs more than normal puppies also need a firm hand, and we create a real problem,when they go out and meet the world,they just dont know how to behave and look to us,they become fearful of other dogs,they get extremely anxious if we leave them,then all of sudden you have a young dog who becomes a difficult dog not a sweet little puppy,you then begin to shout and chastise it and in the end,it ends up homeless,and now because this dog through no fault of its own,cannot adjust to kennel life,it develops even more behavioral problems.
I dont know what the answer is but know its a long and challenging road to get that puppy to become able to live in the real world,in some ways it may have been kinder to pts like there parents.Unless when the puppy is put up for adoption, showing a short film of what could happen to that puppy,but I expect even that may not help, our eureka moment came wen we called in a Dog Behavourist and she watched us with the puppy,how we were walking on egg shells,for instance if it ran and hid from the bowl at feeding time,we would coax it out wrap it in towel and spoon feed it,after she made a comment,we ignored it,knowing that it would eat soon,and sure enough when we went to feed the older dog, we put a bowl down, for Faye didnt think that she would eat,had visions of being charged for cruelty,but the next thing we heard was the sound of the bowl being chased all round the floor,thought Holly is eating hers as well,but looked and Faye had eaten hers and was now cleaning Holly's bowl as well. From that day on,we had a hands off policy no sneaky cuddles she had to earn affection from us.but it was a slow and sometimes you felt like a monster,but she is a better dog for it.Gemini54

I didn't catch the programme but do know what you mean, you see so many dogs that have been in rescue come straight back again because the new owners get so confused and think the dog needs masses of coddling and eight thousand walks a day
When what they really need are "parents" to lead them in the right direction with love and understanding but most of all with realistic boundaries that the dog will learn to understand.

Wasn't impressed with that programme on the whole
The bit that got me was was the voice over at the puppy farm. Something along the lines of;
"It's shocking to see man's best friend in dirty cages like cattle"

Now I know dogs and cows are different and it may have been more of a figure of speech, but I can't actually understand why it's absolutely unthinkable for dogs to be in a situation like that, but nobody bats an eye for cattle in a similar environment.... especially when said on an animal programme
Poor cows

I didn't see it but have been guilty of doing the love over discipline thing with rescues. But when faced with a dog that pees it's self if you stand up it's very difficult to do the parent not the love thing. Took several days for one of ours to even come out of the fireplace where he hid as soon as we got home. Could we have been less loving and given more discipline ? yes but it just wasn't in us to do so with our hearts breaking for him at the time.

I don't do coddling etc with any of my dogs, they are given affection, attention & education. I build up trust slowly with all my dogs & that gives them the confidence to rely on me & look to me.

I've had several rescues of all ages over a number of years & also puppies that have been mentally abused by not having natural access to their mother from birth.

Fair bit of coddling goes on here with all our dogs over the years, especially as they get older and less able.

Mollie is very coddled and doesn't seem any the worse for it although it does mean I never trust anyone else to look after them as no one else can do a proper coddle (love that word LOL).

I'm American, and thus of course didn't see the program. However, I am guilty of coddling puppies at least a bit.

I did this with my puppy, Nigredo. Mainly because he was to live with an older GSD mix that has been known to be crabby and I wanted to protect him. She growled and snarled each time he got all "puppy" but he quickly called her bluff and it went downhill. At the age of only 4 months, he wasn't the least bit afraid of her snarls, growls, and lunges.

He just ran around her in circles, dodged her every nip, and pestered her even more. I waited for her to truly do something to set him straight... and it took a turn for the worse. She eventually gave up and went to turning her back on him instead. BTW, the cats quickly put him in his place with a few claws to the ears/nose.

She was laying down one day, and he went to pester her, she had nowhere to turn... so she growled. 8 month old Nigredo (a bit larger than Jade, now) puffed his chest out and growling back as he suddenly realized his size.

Jade stood her ground, standing and puffing her chest out, as well... and I had never seen them so angry at each other. Realized my mistake and took quick action to prevent a fight. He'd lose badly if he forced Jade into a fight and it would be UGLY. Now they are where they can be around each other without many problems.

No playing, no laying together, and no "I-love-you's" but at least no fights or anguish. Always a bad idea to coddle puppies instead of teaching them proper rules, etc. I fear, though... that I will be one of the ignorant... failing to learn from my mistakes.

Hi julie I know I have one and have been guilty of lots of love,but really try to be stronger,every milestone is hard won,it took six months for her to greet us and wag her tail,and sometimes we have to keep going backwards.What I was referring to,is oh a puppy is so nice,then they become dog with problems,and instead of dealing with it,the dog ends up in rescue.You are dealing with it everyday just as I do,but I know one thing I have commitment,Love and Faye is going no where however hard it gets.Gemini54

I don't think love and training can't go hand in hand. Training positively, calmly and kindly is compatable with being loving. Although a "firm hand' and 'discipline' can just be phrases I prefer to think of it as being consistent. You can be consistent in a kind loving way too.

A lot of people seem to get a pup, rescued of not, and then learn on the hoof rather than researching and learning about puppies and positive ways to train, socialize and avoid issues before they even think of getting a puppy.

It is true that "coddle" and "love" aren't the same things, however; they can easily be confused.

As for getting a puppy, sometimes researching can only do so much. Your puppy could have several combinations of behaviors associated only with you and your home that you might not have read about.

You will of course need to go looking more thoroughly if this happens. I have done lots of reading on dogs and our family has had a dog since before I was born and I've not been without one yet, and despite that... I am still learning about them day after day.

I also find a big mistake in that people get a pure bred dog... and then are stunned big time when their dog doesn't fit the "personality" of the breed. Each dog has it's own personality... likes, dislikes, etc. no matter what breed.

All in all, I agree with you. Knowing about dogs is important... BEFORE you get one.

My dogs still have problems. I will never be able to fix Jade's problems, but I can fix Nigredo's... making things easier for her at least. Sometimes with dogs... being reasonable is far better than being perfect, some people don't seem to get that.