Yeah I'm kind of sick of non americans bashing americans. Have I used a prong? Yes, have I since I learned of other methods? No! Do I wish that contraptions like prongs were more regulated? Yes, they should at the very least only be sold in catalogs or at least only by speciality shops & behind glass.

Invisible fences... no I do not think those are cruel, some people might not have the option of building a fence, they might rent & landlord doesn't want a fence build or thy might live in a subdivison where building a fence is against code, but they shouldn't be barred from getting a dog because of that.

I'm not making excuses, I just try to see al points of view & try not to judge people without knowing all the facts.

erm... then use a lead and take it out rather than the lazy option

America is a huge place, and the culture and way of life can vary enormously from one place to another - living in Georgia is different from living in California is different from living in Texas is different from Washington DC. As it is for humans, so I imagine it will be for dogs. A dog in the midwest will live a different life from that of one just off Central Park in New York.

But even dogs in cosmopolitan areas often live a different life from what we would imagine - even in these areas, to walk somewhere with your dog in high humidity, with no sidewalk, may just not be feasible. And the dog in question may have been bought out a wall of cages in the local pet shop, something that is not seen in the UK, but I assume is still part of the culture in the US.

I imagine those who hold cows sacred probably find our treatment of them difficult to bear - and even cultures which seem as similar as the US and the UK are actually quite different in lots of ways. Dogdragoness' life in Texas is far different from, say, life in Somerset. She may, for all I know, be an excellent morris dancer, but I don't think it is part of Texan culture.

Sorry, but this is just sillyness. I don't have a fence and never have. I WALK my dog, and go out in the yard with her with her on a leash. I'm not going to shock my dog to teach it boundaries, or leave it out there unprotected from other animals NOT wearing the collar who could come and attack my dog at will. The benefits of walking your dogs and supervising its time outside are endless. But thats for another thread.

Thanks for that information.
What I was actually wondering was... is the prevailing move towards progressive training as in the UK taking hold in the US. It seems it is, in spite of National Geographic.

Glad you appreciate it is a huge place, Claire and Daisy. Sometimes people don't recognise the enormity of it, and that it is almost like over 50 different countries and cultures stapled together. Within the country, states can be so huge, that if there is a severe storm coming up in one county within that state, all children are off school in that county, despite the fact that the storm probably won't affect them, and they have a fun day off in brilliant sunshine. Government officials are stopped from going to work too, so they can have a fun day off as well... Then, you have to add in to that mix the different ethnic groups, the climate, the lifestyles, the vastly differing weather conditions within the one country, the landscape, and conditions are different as much for humans as for dogs. Life can be very harsh in some areas, and I doubt some of the people scraping to make a living have the time or inclination to consider going off to dog classes, reading books on differing training methods, going to seminars, or watching dvds.

I think it's hard to generalize the USA because some places here are SO different from others. Some places are very forward-thinking and some places are very conservative. I think a lot of people here are into using positive reinforcement and are getting away from the dominance theories. Most "dog people" are that way over here, the same as they are in the UK.

It tends to be the less dog educated people who buy into common myths about dominance. And sadly, why wouldn't they? People like CM are household names. The idea of the "alpha" is everywhere. Even TV shows not related to dogs use the term alpha (like Stephen Colbert's "alpha dog of the week" segment). It's a pretty common myth that most people think is still true.

I honestly don't see many shock collars on dogs. I've only met one dog who was on a shock collar. I've met more on prongs, but even so I only know a few on them and most were for exceptional reasons (woman down the road has a really active big Doberman and had a major back problem; it was the only way to walk him while they trained him...he's now on a flat collar). Most people I meet are pretty gentle and positive with their dogs.

I do too. And I agree that some people just use older outdated methods because they don't know anything else. I've met a lot of people who talk to me about training and when I talk about positive reinforcement, they seem almost relieved to find there's another way.

We Americans really aren't as backward as some might like to think. And I doubt the entire UK dog owning population is as enlightened either, as people like to make them out.

I live in Somerset but I don't go Morris Dancing! A few folks go Wassailing, and heaven only knows what they get up to in Glastonbury.

Maybe I shouldn't of commented on this thread, as I meant no disrespect, it's just through my eyes, things are different