I use a 25mm wide leather half check.

my point is that I consider it cruel because it works by causing pain. And since I was the OP.............

Yuck, that is hateful
That guy gets paid by loving (but missguided) owners to abuse their dogs
Even if I believed in pinch collers as a training tool EVERY dog in the class?? and no dog should EVER be made to scream
I understand why owners can fall into the trap of thinking 'it must be OK he has all thesse qualifications and noone else is saying anything' - those kind of trainers should be reported for cruelty and shut down

WHy does a dog need any corrections at all?? dogs arnt naughty they either dont know what you want or it isnt rewarding enough for them to do it
either way thats the trainers fault - so any mistake the dog makes the slap or pinch should happen to the handler to make them think about why the dog did the thing they did

(I use a flat coller and lead is hardly ever on - no force should come to a dogs neck - that is such a delicate area)

It's one of my first posts here but to quote Youngstevie, would you let anyone do that to a child ??? then why a dog?
This man is ABUSING animals, dragging, causing pain and screams from a hurt bewildered creature... OMG! indeed.

Who cares about collars and restraints, that's totally immaterial. What you have here is a lust for power and MONEY. No good will come of his 'technique'. He's just abusing his power and his clients good intentions.

Absolutely NO, no quantifiers or possibilities. NO NO NO......

Put it this way, if I wandered into anywhere with a moron abusing dogs like that my first question would be to ask if he likes hospital food, [ tough luck if he does`nt...].
No way would I keep my mouth shut, I would use any means necessary to prevent further suffering to any dogs being abused by such a monster and would do everything possible to get the people being conned into thinking dog abuse is `ok` to get the hell out of there and never go back.

Perhaps a newspaper reporter posing as a prospective new student is in order ?

People go, because usually they have no experince of Dog traineing or current methods, they will hav a unruly dog & that trainer will be able to "seeminly" work "magic" in a few minutes. They are usually Control freak people, Ver y strong Minded & can Justify what they are doing. when i started i went to a checvk Chain only clubs, The methods were Sh** but did work, up to a point, she had people (incuding me for 3 years) wrapped around her little finger, & could back up her methods.

It was only through talking & watching other trainers around the shows that my eyes began to open & "my" rehabilitation started (& ENDED with my Explusion )

but ive got to be honest, at the time it seemed fine & people ended up with well behaved dogs. little robots yes, but well behaved, THATS why people go & why they continue to go.

The only thing we can do is offer a alternative view point in hop some minds may be opened as mine was

MMMnnn this is a hard one for me as I have been in that position with Bruno and was so shocked and unsure that I didnt do anything I am ashamed to say. looking back I feel horrified and guilty that I did nothing,,,

HOWEVER the person concerned did get my previously dog aggressive dog to run through a row of dogs all sitting, to me - ...... he did it through fear and pain as he had choked him on a collar first ....but he did get the desired requirement which was my dog to not attack other dogs....

I was so shocked and overcome that he had actually done this that i didnt realise til I got in the car to come home that Bruno had choke marks, bruising and pulled hairs on his throat from the collar. I sat in the car park and balled my eyes out whilst Bruno sat beside me licking my face and still shaking...


So whilst I would like to say that in that situation I would have given the bloke a piece of my mind etc - I didnt. And its easy to see why people do go to these places as their problem dogs appear to be better and well behaved - its just the wrong way to get them to do that,

I didnt forget the sound of Bruno squealing and the sight of him strung up by a choke collar for a long time.....

This man is not alone in the dog training world - sadly there are too many like him.
;(

Now if anyone did this to my dog I would go mental... but i didnt then... i wish i had

I doubt I would give the trainer a piece of my mind either Dani, as I would be too shocked and am just not the type of person to shout down another. However, I would never go back to that trainer, and would make damned sure that I told all dog owning friends not to go there either.

It is very sad that there are still classes going like that one, run by bullies and idiots

Would I go again if I saw that - no.
Is he cruel? Yes.

Actually I wouldn't have let him put any other collar on my dog, or raise a hand to my dog- but then I am as feisty as my terrier.