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Mad Huskies
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Mad Huskies is offline  
Location: Nottingham, UK
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17-08-2011, 04:57 PM
Originally Posted by Jackbox View Post
have to disagree, SOME pugs are unhealthy, good breeders of pugs will ensure they are breeding from good health tested dogs,

Someone advertising in a shop (no mention of any form of health) will not be taking the same precautions... so breeding an unsuitable pug to any other breed is not going to make the offsprings any healthier.
Not unhealthy? http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Pug#Health_problems

Have a read of those!
And as for the advert itself, I wasn't talking SPECIFICALLY about THAT dog (although we have no way to tell if its health tested or not so thats purely speculation) I was talking in general about the breed.
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DevilDogz
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17-08-2011, 05:07 PM
Originally Posted by Mad Huskies View Post
Thats what I was getting at.. a carefully planned and health tested outcrossing with pugs to a breed like the Chihuahua with very few health problems within the breed, would help with a number of health problems within the pug lines which would ultimatly make the pugs healthier... like they have done over in America with the Dalmations and the pointers.
I think it was a VERY good day for pedigree dogs everwhere when the KC accepted the Dally pointer girl onto the registry.
I dont understand what a chihuahua would have to offer health wise to a pug?
- The pointer and dalmation out crossing was done because of a genetic defect that affected dalmations the comformation of both breeds are quite similar.
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Jackie
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17-08-2011, 05:12 PM
Originally Posted by Mad Huskies View Post
Not unhealthy? http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Pug#Health_problems

Have a read of those!
And as for the advert itself, I wasn't talking SPECIFICALLY about THAT dog (although we have no way to tell if its health tested or not so thats purely speculation) I was talking in general about the breed.
I understand that, but its not to hard to beleive that such an advert is not one from a breeder who has the health of her dogs at the forefront of their intention.

Took this bit from your link.

Pugs can suffer from necrotizing meningoencephalitis (NME), also known as pug dog encephalitis (PDE), an inflammation of the brain and meninges, that also occurs in other small-breed dogs, such as the Maltese and Chihuahua
Which highlights the reasons why you would not mix two different breeds , not much point when both suffer from the same ailments.

Chi`s suffer the same ailments as many a toy breed, one of which is the pug.

As I sad, not ALL pugs suffer from hereditary ailments, many breeders DO health test their dogs (even if no requirements are asked for) and and ensure they only breed from those dogs who are not over exaggerated , their are plenty of happy healthy pugs out there, much better to be more selective within a breed, than introduce another which suffers as many health issues (or more) than the one you are trying to improve.
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JoedeeUK
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17-08-2011, 05:51 PM
Originally Posted by Mad Huskies View Post
Can I say something controversial? IMHO Pugs are one of those few breeds that are soooo unhealthy that cross breeding is actually doing the breed a favour.
I believe if it was done properly with proper health testing of both breeds (NOT just to jump on the designer cross breed fad) then I think it would be better off for the breed as a whole!
You are so far from the mark

In a later post you describe a Dalmatian imported from the USA that has 1 Pointer in it's pedigree many generations back as a "Dally pointer", the bitch isn't a "Dally Pointer"cross she has 1 pointer some 13/14 generations back in the pedigree. To quote the LUAdalmatian site

The “Dalmatian Back-cross Project” commenced in 1973 with the original out-cross of an AKC registered Champion Pointer sire bred to an AKC registered Dalmatian dam.
Dr. Robert Schaible conducted the breeding in an effort to address the fixed genetic defect in Dalmatians that affects uric acid metabolism and that may lead to increased urinary uric acid, urate crystals, urinary bladder aggregate formation, stones, urinary tract obstruction and even death.

This wonderful breeding program is presently at the 14th generation from the original cross.
The progeny have 99.98% AKC registered Dalmatians in their pedigrees and on parentage analysis, their DNA is 99.8% the same as AKC registered Dalmatians.
This was done with the genetic knowledge that Dalmatians would improve in health.

Willy nilly crossing any two breeds together is not the same as the LUA Dalmatian project, so simply putting to different breeds together that have similar health problems is not the way to go.

BTW not ALL Pugs are sooooo unhealthy, progress will be slow improving the health of dogs, because the health problems did not just happen overnight, but have been the result of past breeding before health testing was available.

Back in the 1960s around 20% of ISDS registered Border Collies had eye problems that affected their lives, with the development of two eye tests for PRA & CEA & simply not breeding from affected dogs & known carriers(via test matings or because offspring developed the condition)has reduced it to less than 0.01% & with DNA testing will prevent 100% of CEA affected puppies being born
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