But it doesn't seem to be working with the missed breakfast coz Tabitha said this Quote "I let him off the lead and waited until there were some other dogs around and then I immediately recalled Dexter - and he totally ignored me.

That is what I suggested, unfortunately, as on this thread there are some people who consider NOT feeding EXCEPT on recalls as = starving.

Which of course it does not.

There is nothing "inhumane" about feeding a dog ONLY when recall training.

However NOT teaching a reliable recall is inhumane when it results in dead dogs and or dead people (ie when dog bogs off into the road)!

Tabitha, remember, your dog has practised ignoring you for how long?

Say it was for two years, do you think it is reasonable to expect a reliable recall in (how many weeks have you been training?)

I often wonder if those who believe recall training is SO simple for all dogs that they have EVER trained a breed or an individual that is not "handler dependent"?

As Suzanne Clothier aptly puts it:

There are dogs who "carry" their handlers, politely ignoring human failings while carrying out the assigned task with style.

Then there are the "others".

As I said before, this method of training is not unique to me and if it was "INHUMANE" or involved "STARVATION" do you honestly think that members of the APDT (proponent of kind, fair and effective training) would put on courses with those who support this method and indeed have written about it such as John Rogerson?

As a KCAI (Working Trials) and KCAI (Behaviourist) do you think that he actively breaches their Code of Practice?

http://www.thekennelclub.org.uk/down...nstructors.pdf

Because if you DO I would strongly suggest that you write to both organisations accusing him of "inhumanity" to dogs and get him "removed" from the KCAI scheme and the APDT to ban courses with such a cruel, inhumane personage.

Not sure who all the "proper trainers" were around the time you were training dogs Helena54 as AFAIK JR has been around some time, but perhaps you have trained with instructors who are FAR more skilled, knowledgeable, able and experienced than him?

Obviously the "boloney" that he speaks is just that, that is why he is in demand all over the world including (gasp, horror, shriek) by rescue centres and charities including (more shock horror) The Dogs Trust and the UFAW (Universities Federation for Animal Welfare)!

Better write to them and get JR removed as well?!

So are you seriously suggesting that these organisations which have at their HEART the WELFARE of animals, supports an individual who is "inhumane"?

I would strongly suggest that the only person who is talking the "most utter bolony I think I've ever heard in my entire life" is YOU Helena54!

And I am not sure where you get the FACTS that you quiote from?

Is that years of training dogs of all breeds, temperaments, backgrounds a reliable recall?

What precisely are YOUR skills, knowledge, ability, training and experience in this area?
Do you teach regularly? Do you have pupils who go on to succeed in many disciplines? Do you train Dog Training Instructors? Do you put on seminars all over the world?

& id be doing it for months! -if it worked!

When are you putting on YOUR recall seminar madmare?

Cos I think Tabitha (and others) would like to attend this so you can demonstrate all thes other "humane" ways to teach a dog recall, and once again the dog is not being starved.

Perhaps you have published some books, or made some DVDs?

Sorry but your sarcasm and nastiness cuts no ice with me and you won't get to me talking that way you just look stupid. I am not the one that thread after thread makes out they know everything about everything better than anyone else and dismisses everyone elses ideas.
What if this dog does not recall for its food which it doesn't seem to be doing then it obviously will not be fed as it has been said it only gets fed if it recalls.
I have trained lots of dogs over the years using my method and some have not needed a long line and have been easy, but I don't say it will work with every dog.
As none of us have actually seen the dog to note its body language etc my advice would be to get a one to one trainer or a behaviourist.

I don't have any skills in dog training, but I have various other skills!

I have a RIGHT to voice my opinion in any thread I like and whether or not it goes along with you doesn't mean diddly squat to me - fact!

I don't care what you've done, who you've trained with, blah, blah, blah and of course, we know all about that coz you're forever blowing that bladdy great trumpet of yours about that, so if these are YOUR training methods too, then yes, I totally, utterly disagree with them, along with all the others you've named dropped up there that I can't be a*sed to pick out!

As I've said to you many a time before, my dogs are just dogs, they are well mannered and do everything I ask of them, I get the help I need when I need it from trainers I respect and know well, and I get help on here when I need it. The reason my dogs are well behaved is because I have used my noddle and trained them up to suit their lifestyle, I don't need to have my dogs sitting beside some bladdy trophy, cycled 16 miles a day trained to a high level because that would bore the pants off me, I just like to enjoy my dogs and if it's ok with you, then I will stick to my way of doing things and not listen to any of your advice - thanks!

I hope you fall off that high horse of yours one day too!! You are now going on my ignore list coz quite honestly, your arrogance is now infuriating me let alone just annoying me!

Tabitha, remember, your dog has practised ignoring you for how long?

Say it was for two years, do you think it is reasonable to expect a reliable recall in (how many weeks have you been training?)