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DevilDogz
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23-10-2010, 11:15 AM
Raising dogs in a good enviroment, having contact with them..Not shoved out in a room and left.

Breeding for a reason which for me would be to keep to carry on in a certain area - working, showing ect..

Has a great understanding on their breed, their lines, their own dogs.. and can share all that with new owners..

Health testing is important - but alone doesnt make a breeder ethical..

Not breeding for profit, charging more for different colours and the like.

Take dogs back at any point, and offers life time support to their pups new owners regardless if they stop breeding or what ever while their pups are still out in the community.
Can see the bad points in their lines and dogs, and will openly share these not just think all their dogs are perfect like alot do..

Will not sell a pup as 'show quality'.. You can not tell at 8weeks, its just show potential and that should be explained to new owners, the amount of people that have been sold a 'show quality' pup that isnt actually good enough for the ring is getting silly.. Just remember what often happens to them dogs...

Will have homes lined up and waiting before pups are born.

Cares about the people that come for their pups and will not just sell to the first person that enquires, if they are not suitable.
Will not sell to some one the day they have just meet them, will arrange to meet them a number of times first and get to know each other...

Send pups with contracts and endorsments.

Being a member of a breed club.

and another one for me is, supporting breed rescues and the like. Now i am defo not saying you are a bad breeder for not helping out.. But I would be alot happier with a breeder If I knew they were helping out with their breed in all areas.. That truely shows me they are passionate.


and more than likely a whole lot more...
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Lionhound
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23-10-2010, 11:26 AM
Originally Posted by MerlinsMum View Post
The above, plus:
Makes certain dogs are old enough for breeding (varies from breed to breed).
Does not breed for the sake of it - i.e. produces litters for a reason, not just because they can, or to make money.
Does not overbreed the bitch/es.
Probably also does something with their dogs, i.e. showing, working, obedience - not just breeding.
Fully paid up and respected member of breed club and adheres to breed club policies.
Probably difficult to define, but I would expect to see a real and genuine bond and love of their dogs, with a great deal of mutual trust, above all other considerations.
Someone who is able and willing to go 'the extra mile' for their dogs, for whatever reason, without hesitation.
All of these.

I also would want a breeder to have lived with both sexes of their chosen breed from pup until adulthood until they pass and know the breed inside out.
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Murf
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23-10-2010, 11:41 AM
I was reading a breeders contract yesterday where dogs and bitches cost the same and if you prove that you chip your dog insure your dog and neuter your dog when the time is right they will refund 250 of the cost of the pup as your proving you want a pet not a dog to breed from..
Seemed a really good idea to me...
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Tupacs2legs
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23-10-2010, 01:43 PM
Originally Posted by Murf View Post
I was reading a breeders contract yesterday where dogs and bitches cost the same and if you prove that you chip your dog insure your dog and neuter your dog when the time is right they will refund 250 of the cost of the pup as your proving you want a pet not a dog to breed from..
Seemed a really good idea to me...
me too
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swarthy
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23-10-2010, 03:58 PM
Originally Posted by Murf View Post
I was reading a breeders contract yesterday where dogs and bitches cost the same and if you prove that you chip your dog insure your dog and neuter your dog when the time is right they will refund 250 of the cost of the pup as your proving you want a pet not a dog to breed from..
Seemed a really good idea to me...
That's one lucky breeder who is clearly either dripping in cash or overcharges for her pups by that amount so it can be refunded.

Most breeders run at enough of a financial loss as it is - all my pups carry endorsements with a very strict criteria for what is required to lift them.

I understand that this, in practice doesn't stop someone breeding from the dog, however, if someone has put the time and effort in to find a good breeder - often including travelling many miles to get these pups with the right health tests from the right environment - and if the breeder has vetted them well enough - then the risk of them breeding without carrying out the required tests is much lower.

My breeding endorsement requirements are laid out in black and white and signed by the owner and me and we BOTH have a copy - under which grounds the KC will NOT lift without permission, if they are not happy to sign, then they don't get a pup - SIMPLES!

So far, every pup who owners have considered breeding from bar two have been neutered - one MIGHT breed with my support (subject to satisfactory health results and my recommendation of stud dog) - the other is a dog in the working world and I know for a fact they wouldn't entertain standing him unless he proves his worth - and if he does and his health results are OK - they will have my blessing.
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Tupacs2legs
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23-10-2010, 04:18 PM
Originally Posted by swarthy View Post
That's one lucky breeder who is clearly either dripping in cash or overcharges for her pups by that amount so it can be refunded.

Most breeders run at enough of a financial loss as it is - all my pups carry endorsements with a very strict criteria for what is required to lift them.

I understand that this, in practice doesn't stop someone breeding from the dog, however, if someone has put the time and effort in to find a good breeder - often including travelling many miles to get these pups with the right health tests from the right environment - and if the breeder has vetted them well enough - then the risk of them breeding without carrying out the required tests is much lower.

My breeding endorsement requirements are laid out in black and white and signed by the owner and me and we BOTH have a copy - under which grounds the KC will NOT lift without permission, if they are not happy to sign, then they don't get a pup - SIMPLES!

So far, every pup who owners have considered breeding from bar two have been neutered - one MIGHT breed with my support (subject to satisfactory health results and my recommendation of stud dog) - the other is a dog in the working world and I know for a fact they wouldn't entertain standing him unless he proves his worth - and if he does and his health results are OK - they will have my blessing.
no amount of vetting of people you do not know will determine wether they will be kept,bred from etc and 'puppy contracts' are generally not worth the paper they are written on,yes they may scare some people,but they only mean anything to the honourable new owners anyway.
as u already put .. since when does endorsements stop people breeding
so the progeny wouldnt be kc reg... and??(the sort of people that would go ahead anyway wouldnt care bout registration)

sorry but i think that comment hit a raw spot.... you sell say a pedigree sibe for £700-800 you take out £250 and put it aside.... what big loss to breeder?
imo opinion it is not an ideal world...and money speaks volumes sadly...its a great idea,play em at their own game i say
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DevilDogz
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23-10-2010, 04:22 PM
Endorsments are often not worth the paper their written on your right, and dont not stand up in a court of law. BUT for me its something, you have done the very most you can to protect any pups you let out into the community. That something, is for me better than nothing.
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mishflynn
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23-10-2010, 04:24 PM
Originally Posted by Adam Palmer View Post
Define the above.

Health checks.

& good results

Rearing conditions.

Take the dog back.

Life time support ect.

Adam
Also i would be saying

Not selling to unsuitable people

Number of litters/ number of bitches/ number of litters from a bitch etc

A very good knowlrdge of the breed/type they are selling/breeding
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Tupacs2legs
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23-10-2010, 04:27 PM
Originally Posted by DevilDogz View Post
Endorsments are often not worth the paper their written on your right, and dont not stand up in a court of law. BUT for me its something, you have done the very most you can to protect any pups you let out into the community. That something, is for me better than nothing.
it does nothing dd.. only people that take notice r the good guys to start with.

... it may clear a few breeders conciousness(sp) tho
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swarthy
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23-10-2010, 04:29 PM
Originally Posted by Tupacs2legs View Post
sorry but i think that comment hit a raw spot.... you sell say a pedigree sibe for £700-800 you take out £250 and put it aside.... what big loss to breeder?
imo opinion it is not an ideal world...and money speaks volumes sadly...its a great idea,play em at their own game i say
my pups are not sold for anywhere near the amounts you specify.

To have a litter with all costs taken into consideration on health tests, stud fees, food, microchipping, registrations, vets bills etc costs thousands - my last litter I was over £1K out of pocket - that is WITHOUT any loss of earnings.

So on top of that, you now want me to put £1,500 aside to give back to the puppy buying public - bringing the costs of the pups well down below those from a PF who produces litters with NO tests or extras - and you have the audacity to mention it being about money
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