Hi brainless: Boss wasn't impressed but it is my lb now, so I should be ok!

Beats me how people cannot see that talking about dogs and horses is FAR more important than their dictation - unreasonable of them, but there we are!

At the end of the day, Brainless, you are quite right - far better for a dog to be exercised and stimulated with HTM work, than to be allowed to lie around bored out of his brains getting fat. But I still personally do not like to see HTM - I think there are far better things that the talented Ms Ray could be doing with the amazing gift that she has.

I dont agree with your comments, but hey, we are all entitled to our opinions.

Personally by what I have seen, I believe the dogs enjoy what they are doing, they dont look forced and being collies, they are ever eager to please.

As long as the dogs do this willingly and are having fun then I see no harm in it.
Dogs are people animals, its not like she is using a wild animal to prance infront of gawking crowds.

Plus, after all the recent bad publicity of dogs, its good for dogs to get some good press.

Myself, I wouldnt want my dog to do these tricks, I much prefare her doing what comes naturally to her.

You keep saying the same thing Gnasher.
What suggestions do you have that Mary could do with her talents, because you've not followed up any of your posts with any?


Just to list a few things she already does.

Trains her dogs and teaches. HTM, Obedience, Agility, Flyball all over the country.

Supports a lot of doggy charities and helps with training with behavioural problems.

Helps individuals with problematic dogs (normally problematic owners) to help them train their dogs.

Does a lot of free publicity for dog charities and awareness of how to look after your dogs health and mind.

Travels all over the world promoting good dog ownership.
She accomplishes more for our dogs than most of us including you could ever dream of.

Fine if you are in favour or not of Heelwork to Music. Most of it is advanced obedience work for dogs. But why do you single out Mary Ray like the whole things her fault.
How you can comment that the dogs are miserable when you have never tried it. You say the dogs do it to please their owner. That applies to anything you ask a dog to do, whether you ask them to sit, lie down, come back. They probably don't want to but they do because they respect you and want to please you.
I personally don't do HTM with my dogs. It's about the only thing that I don't do, however
healthwise. Agility is more dangerous to a dogs health than HTM.
Making an assumption from something you saw on your tele from Crufts does not make a case.
I respect your view that you don't like HTM. Everyone's entitled to one, but to slate Mary Ray without any knowledge of her. When you have contributed as much as she has to the dog nation in this country, maybe I would take you more seriously

Out of interest, what is it that comes naturally to your breed? What were they bred for? (Or should this be a different thread).

BTW I am asking out of genuine interest, not to start a debate

Well said Megan.
Mary does a great job for dogdom!!
HTM is just a small part of it. She was a famous dog trainer long before Crufts came along and show cased her talents.
In fact in the early days of her demonstrating at Crufts it was classed as obedience.

Great Post Megan Mary Ray does a good job

i second that great post megan. mary does fantastic work for the dog world. she just happens to be famous for HTM at the mo cos its the up and coming discipline. i dont care what anyone thinks i'm going to carry on doing HTM!!!

Ooh, I'm feeling the love. Thanks

So you should Megan you are also a very intelligent person that speaks a lot of sense and I'm a creep

my two do htm and agility and also work if they didnt enjoy what they did i wouldnt put them through it but my two are happy healthy they are kept stimulted happy and well loved if a dog didnt enjoy doing these things then they wouldnt do it