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Location: cumbria, UK
Joined: May 2008
Posts: 191
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22-01-2009, 04:02 PM
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Location: Nr Edinburgh
Joined: Apr 2005
Posts: 5,350
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22-01-2009, 04:03 PM
Originally Posted by Louise13 
If he is such a good trainer..WHY did he have to KICK the dog???
If my dogs grumble they get an "annoyed noise" from me..not a kick!!
The dog was fine til he kicked it..then it kicked off at him...
Damn sure if he had kicked me I would have had a go at him too!!
WHY DOES A TRAINER NEED TO KICK A DOG???
For the people telling us how wonderful he is..can you answer me that??
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Location: dogsville
Joined: Jan 2006
Posts: 16,141
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22-01-2009, 04:04 PM
Originally Posted by Louise13
I assume nobody read this??
WHY DOES A TRAINER NEED TO KICK A DOG???
For the people telling us how wonderful he is..can you answer me that??
I did.
Ia agreed with you.
I also agree with Dilkara
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Location: Wiltshire, UK
Joined: Nov 2008
Posts: 5,374
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22-01-2009, 04:07 PM
There isn't much more to say than that really imho.
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Location: Dogsey and Worcestershire
Joined: May 2004
Posts: 49,483
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22-01-2009, 04:13 PM
Originally Posted by Ace_Animals
Thats fair enough, but to me, there are far too many people calling themselves "behaviourists" with all manner of "qualifications"
I do agree with you on this part, for me this devalues the work of the Behaviourists who have trained for years.
Originally Posted by Dilkara
I hope people wont think this is a frivolous and pointless comment, but whenever I see CM techniques I am always reminded of Jack London's 'Call of the Wild' the outdated techniques of basically beating a dog into submission. (whether with actual beatings, or the pinches, kicks and strangulation methods that CM uses) I don't think forcing a dog to your will creates a cure, it creates a fear response and then resentment IMO.
I think you are in good company, most of the respected trainers and behaviourist would agree with you ..
Originally Posted by Louise13
I assume nobody read this??
WHY DOES A TRAINER NEED TO KICK A DOG???
eeeerrrrm.....because he doesn't know any better?
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Location: n/a
Joined: Sep 2008
Posts: 2,459
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22-01-2009, 04:13 PM
Originally Posted by Louise13
I don't KICK my kids either!
Don't think you can really compare training methods of dogs and kids
Also "kick" - did he really "kick" the dog or make contact with his foot. There is a difference
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Location: grangemouth for the moment
Joined: Apr 2006
Posts: 14,890
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22-01-2009, 04:13 PM
Originally Posted by Ace_Animals
Do you not consider CM to be an experienced behaviourist? The amount of time CM seemingly spends with the dogs he sees goes far and beyond what a lot of behaviourists do - in this country and the US. Many seem to think that a 1 or 2 hour session will be the "cure all". Which of course is never the case.
So, although we only see maybe 20-30 minutes per dog, per episode, this doesn't mean to say that is all that happens. There'll be a helluva lot of work done before the cameras are even set rolling. It wouldn't surprise me if CM doesn't get himself involved at this point other than maybe purely observation (just knowing how TV works - maybe he only does the presenting bit and the interview bit for the camera) but by the same token, he may not do and even if he himself doesn't get involved until the cameras are rolling, other researchers for the show will be involved before, during and after filming.
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Location: n/a
Joined: Sep 2008
Posts: 2,459
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22-01-2009, 04:15 PM
Originally Posted by Pidge
We could talk about CM until we're blue in the face but at the end of the day, as with our children, we all bring our dogs up the way we want and therefore agree with someone who uses our methods or disagree if they don't.
There isn't much more to say than that really imho.
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Location: Scottish Borders
Joined: Nov 2006
Posts: 13,902
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22-01-2009, 04:17 PM
Originally Posted by Louise13
I assume nobody read this??
WHY DOES A TRAINER NEED TO KICK A DOG???
For the people telling us how wonderful he is..can you answer me that??
When a dog gets into 'a zone' (completely focused on something else) it will usually fail to respond to any verbal communication but a strong physical touch will often 'snap it out' of this state - yes the dog does get a surprise, but arguably that is what is needed to 'break the spell'.
As to why he uses his feet, he frequently works with more than one dog at a time and I guess he has found it easier to use a foot rather than an arm as he may not always have an arm free.
As to whether you would class it as kicking a dog - I'm not so sure. I can't see the clip but have watched quite a few episodes including that one and from what I remember, he has used enough force with his foot for the dog to notice, but not enough to cause pain or physical harm.
And for those who would say that any touch with the foot is a kick - how many of you slap your dogs affectionately on the bum either because they enjoy it or maybe as a 'move out of the way'...well that could be classed as smacking your dog.
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