Will they ever get on

Hi, This will be long so please bear with me, as I need you to no my dogs so you can comment.
As most of you know I have 3 SBT's 1 male and 2 bitches they all get on brilliantly
Recently a new man has come into my life (human form ) He has a gorgeous male Border Collie of about 4/5 years old. He shows no aggression around other dogs. (he has been known to pee on a few but thats another thread) Anyway as our relationship progresses we know we need all dogs to get along, Which also will mean in the same house in time hopefully
My concern is Toesy my male, not so worried about my two bitches.
I obviously know my dogs inside out. Rio my youngest bitch 21 months will be perfectly fine indoors and out, I've got no worries at all about them getting along. Ruby my other bitch 5yrs is unpredictable I'm not always 100% how she's going to act but still got no major concerns cos she's not really nasty and wouldn't fully attack a dog. Out and when off lead if she gets away with it she will run at a dog sometimes snapping but doesn't really fight, she's just showing off. Not sure how she'd be with another dog in the house, but don't think she would seriously attack. Toesy off lead out and about is fine, much better than Ruby, he doesn't attempt fight just usually sniffs and walks on when told. But also has never attempted to play with another dog. On lead he is totally different, if he sees a dog at a distance he's not bothered by it and would ignore it. but if I met someone I knew and stood for a chat and Toesy was on lead he would growl and act as if he wants to attack the dog, even if he had seen the same dog off lead 10 mins before and was perfectly normal with it. He is the same at shows especially with other Staffies (funnily he's not like it with other breeds at shows) But if a Staffie gets too close to his cage he goes balistic. And in the ring if he's not totally transfixed on me because of treats he'd want to go for every dog, especially some that he knows and both dislike each other with a vengence. He's terrible growling and lunging all the time, then won't walk properly. No-one would believe that the same dog could be off lead in the park and not be bothered with other dogs, It's really strange.
Now my friend brought his dog on Sunday and he went on the grass where I walk them and waited for me. I didn't want to introduce Tosey to him on lead incase that made him growl, I didn't want an instant dislike.
So I put Ruby on lead and just let Toesy an Rio run over to him. they were both ok. His dog seemed a bit worried at first. When I let Ruby off she kept running at him not biting though but he didn't know how to take her (understandably) That eventually led to him and Toesy having a bit of a ruck, nothing serious and they stopped as soon as we shouted their names. We carried on and had a 30min walk Rio was totally fine as i expected, Ruby got bored of running at him and gave up and Toesy was good enough for us to feel happy with the first meeting. He ignored him mostly, he did sniff him occasionally and let him sniff him also. I only had to warn him once when I thought he looked like he was going to go for him. After the walk I didn't want to take them into the house so took them all straight into the garden. wandering around on the lawn they were all ok, but if both males came to us for a pet and they got quite close to each other I had to keep repeatedly warning Toesy and getting more of a distance between them, I didn't trust him. A bit later Toesy went into the house for a while then came back out, and it was then that he started growling so I put him back in.
Sorry this is so long, so anyone who has actually got to the end before getting too bored Does it sound to you there is a chance they could get along in the future, or will I never be able to trust Toesy with him.
Views and advice please

Mitch

Just a quick question - is the BC castrated?

Im quite sure he's not.
Would it be better if he was

Mitch

If the BC is the least aggressive of the pair then yes, it could well make a considerable difference in how easily your male accepts him. If you think about it your boy has had his girls all to himself (whether he has bred them or not makes no difference, they are his 'harem') now you introduce possible competition for their favours and, insult to injury, also bring the usurper onto his territory. By castrating the BC his testosterone levels will decrease over 3-6 months and your male will sense this and may therefore be more accepting of him. It is not a 100% guarantee that all will be roses but it could make life easier all round.

The lead thing is probably a form of territorial aggression. Off lead Toesy can choose who he greets and he can increase his personal space from other dogs if he wishes to do so. On lead he is constrained, he can't move away, and if other dogs impinge on his personal space he becomes uncomfortable and tells them to 'move it'.

To be on the safe side keep an eagle eye on the dogs when the BC is around, and never, ever, leave them unsupervised with him.

Think under the circumstances you did very well, to introduce an adult dog into an established household of 3 dogs is not the easiest thing to attempt. Your three are a group and will defend one another should they feel the need and although you had a little trouble I think you will get there if you preserver and continue as before.

Then you have the breeds that are not the easiest either, the Staffie who is afraid of nothing and a BC that can be unduly worried by things that are new to it. Think castration may help but it is too early to try that, continue as you are and I think you will win through, until you have a bitch in season and then you may have to kennel. Also think it will be the older bitch that may cause the trouble either directly or because she is probably the boss and will be liable to pick on one of the others if she feels someone wants putting in their place. Could be that your going back to basics with her and allowing her no favour nor special attention to ensure that you have better control over her.

You could try taking your 3 to visit his home after the walk together, first outside, sometimes finish at yours, sometimes at his and may be sometimes in the garden of a dog frendly pub.

Tell you what if your intended OH had a bitch I would be far less sure that you will make this work.

Thanks SB for your advice no I would never risk leaving Toesy and Lucky (BC) together unsupervised. With me having Staffies already I no that is a total no no.

Thordell, thanks. Yes I think we did quite well too for a first meeting, None of them are totally full on aggressive or I wouldn't of attempted it. I mean some Staffies can never be around other dogs full stop, even one's they live with.
We will definitely perserver slowly. My Boyfriend lives in another town about 25 miles away, so I doubt my dogs will ever need to go there. Plus he is in the process of moving. If we ever get to live together it will be in my house.

Believe it or not my young bitch Rio was in the first stages of a season, not far enough for Toesy to show an interest, but Lucky did sniff her a lot, but there again he seemed to sniff Ruby more.

I seriously don't think there is a top dog amongst my 3, and if so I haven't picked up on it. I'm top dog and they no it. I treat them all the same and they is never any fighting. In fact if anything I would say my older bitch is lowest in the rank, only due to the fact when they are out chasing a stick or a toy Toesy and Rio can attemp to take it from each other and play tug etc but Ruby doesn't really try to take anything from them and occasionally if she does they snap at her.

Mitch

Hi Mitch

I hope you manage to work things out, I really do. I have no advice as I have never done what you are attempting to do.
Although we did have a "lost Lab" who came back from a walk the girls (well Tess was a puppy) seemed to know he was just a guest, lost and not here to stay.

But it seems an excellent start. And I do think that the idea of having the BC
castrated is a good one but before you make that step you could peak to the vet and there is I believe a "tablet or injection" you can have/give that reduces the ammount of testosterone. Just ask your vet because in the back of my mind I am sure there is something.

Karen