It is interesting

The whole perception of this kind of thing in humans (including myself) is very interesting.

Like Tarimoor said earlier, we are disgusted at the stress put on a fox being chased by hounds, but will go to the supermarket and by chicken that has most likely spent it's whole life being stressed at unnatural confined conditions it's forced to live in. At least the fox's life is "natural" until the day it get's chased by the hounds!

Dogs exist because we created them (as in selectively bred from wolves, not some god-like creation ) so it's deemed unnatural, but would anyone bat an eyelid at a wolf pack hunting down a fox and eating it? If they did it would just be "nature," yet dogs are exempt from behaving like the carnivore ancestors?

What if a pack of wild dogs did it? Would this be classed the same as a pack of fox-hounds doing it? Is it the human influence that makes the divide?

Copper had a handbags at dawn mexican stand-off early one morning with a fox, was really funny seeing a wee fox red dog staring out a fox

It's a deal then!

A deal it is

I do think you're right about it being the human influence.

I've often wondered if it has to do with the way we perceive ourselves.

Despite our advanced reasoning abilities, intellect and complex social structure, we are still animals, nothing more nothing less.
I think many people don't want to see us for what we truly are, in a balanced way.

Animal is a derogatory word when used by most people, when describing us...after all we're supposed to be humans, the only animal species that aren't animals lol.

The only species apparently unaffected by instincts of any kind...the only species who can dismiss millions of years of evolution as irrelivent, simply because some say so.

It makes perfect sence to me why some may enjoy killing, just like it makes sence that other species enjoy it.

I think it's very difficult to describe (for want of a better word) to someone who is opposed to shooting, why we do it. I have been shooting for nearly 20 years and I still get the same feeling when I have shot something. I get the adrenalin when I am pulling the trigger (or stalking something), I get a moments sadness (although that is too strong a word), then pride that I have cleanly shot something. If that means that I enjoy killing, then yes I do. I love working dogs and love shooting over my pointing dogs as we are working as a team.

We regularly eat pheasant through the shooting season. That pheasant has been reared and released to live as natural a life as possible - better than a lot of chickens that people buy in the local supermarket. I saw a quote in a magazine once saying something along the lines of "why are people still shooting, when you can go and buy your meat from Tesco's" If that is the mentality that we are dealing with, as a shooting community, we are never going to convince a portion of antis.

There are an AWFUL lot of things in this community, that I don't agree with but imagine you get that in all walks of life - how some people train for agility, or how they treat their show dogs. Just because, there are a few out there who don't behave as you wish, it doesn't mean you stop doing the activity that you love.

As I have previously said, shooting plays a MASSIVE part of my life, as it is the reason we are living where we do and we can actualy afford to live the lifestyle that we enjoy.

Now, hunting, I feel is a part of the shooting (country) community, and although there are things/people/actions, I don't agree with, I am not going to damn the whole scene. I have seen instances where it is needed but do feel that there are instances it isn't necessary. I have seen, first hand, the rudeness of some followers and have actually found the "toffs" who follow the hounds, more courteous, than the "average" follower.

It isn't just toffs who follow hunts anyway. I lived in, very much hunting country, and most of the followers were farmers/shepherds/military.

There are some things which are indefensive, but I do feel that hounds chasing a fox, is just as natural as a fox chasing a rabbit. We took away the natural predator of the fox, but did replace it with hounds. We may like to think we live in a "natural" world but the countryside is the way that man as managed it. If it's not managed, you don't get the same degree of wildlife.

Helen

Because the fox is killing to survive, and the hound is not.

food chain

Well said!

[QUOTE=Helen;2444829]I think it's very difficult to describe (for want of a better word) to someone who is opposed to shooting, why we do it. I have been shooting for nearly 20 years and I still get the same feeling when I have shot something. I get the adrenalin when I am pulling the trigger (or stalking something), I get a moments sadness (although that is too strong a word), then pride that I have cleanly shot something. If that means that I enjoy killing, then yes I do. I love working dogs and love shooting over my pointing dogs as we are working as a team.

We regularly eat pheasant through the shooting season. That pheasant has been reared and released to live as natural a life as possible - better than a lot of chickens that people buy in the local supermarket. I saw a quote in a magazine once saying something along the lines of "why are people still shooting, when you can go and buy your meat from Tesco's" If that is the mentality that we are dealing with, as a shooting community, we are never going to convince a portion of antis.

There are an AWFUL lot of things in this community, that I don't agree with but imagine you get that in all walks of life - how some people train for agility, or how they treat their show dogs. Just because, there are a few out there who don't behave as you wish, it doesn't mean you stop doing the activity that you love.

As I have previously said, shooting plays a MASSIVE part of my life, as it is the reason we are living where we do and we can actualy afford to live the lifestyle that we enjoy.

Now, hunting, I feel is a part of the shooting (country) community, and although there are things/people/actions, I don't agree with, I am not going to damn the whole scene. I have seen instances where it is needed but do feel that there are instances it isn't necessary. I have seen, first hand, the rudeness of some followers and have actually found the "toffs" who follow the hounds, more courteous, than the "average" follower.

It isn't just toffs who follow hunts anyway. I lived in, very much hunting country, and most of the followers were farmers/shepherds/military.

There are some things which are indefensive, but I do feel that hounds chasing a fox, is just as natural as a fox chasing a rabbit. We took away the natural predator of the fox, but did replace it with hounds. We may like to think we live in a "natural" world but the countryside is the way that man as managed it. If it's not managed, you don't get the same degree of wildlife.

Helen[/QUOTe

Brilliant post Helen and have to agree with all of it, the shoot i work on loves and respects the area and the birds, , and absolutely all that are shot get eaten by someone, it manages the woodland on the estate, and the birds are treated very very well and i always say to anyone that asks, its the ultimate in freerange, funnily enough i had the chicken argument with my SIL last week, who goes to Tesco and buys two for a fiver.

Not always.

Helen