Originally Posted by Wysiwyg
Is that the trainer or the dog?
Definately the dog :smt005
THis one was under one of the Dog Borstal bunch. Their method is to alarm the dog with the bottle which is totally wrong.After the first episode was iared, behaviourists got an influx of calls from people saying they watched it, tried it, and oops their dogs bit them.
In using it incorrectly, [ as in the Staffies case ], where the dog not only see`s the bottle but has it thrown toward them, [ as demonstrated frequently on the program ], where a dog is fearful because of it, it creates a bigger reaction toward the trigger to the behaviour the bottle is being used for.
For example, this lads dog aggression :
See a dog, react toward the dog, bottle is used in a way the reactive dogs see`s as a punishment, dog blames the other dog and becomes even more reactive and so it escalates.
This is common whatever the trigger, as the negative association increases the original trigger from something relatively minor [ like barking when someone knocks at the door ] and can increase to something major [ like whoever is at the door becoming a target because them being there corresponds to the fear / fright / negativity of the bottle/punishment ].
So, if sound is used as a distraction, it should be something which is not negative by the dogs perception, but simply an attention getter which the dog wants to investigate out of interest, not out of shock or uncomfortable suprise.
It could be the handler making a clicking sound from the mouth, making keys chink, opening a container the dogs knows its treats are in, anything positive which causes a momentary distraction, at which, with good timing, the positive aspect is increased by the dog being asked to do something reliable [ even just a `sit` for instance ], which then elicits praise.
The reason I suggest asking for something reliable in the moment of quiet, [ if thats a `sit` for instance ], rather than rewarding straight away, is that if the timing is not perfect the dog can think the reward was for the barking itself, not for stopping it. Distracting then immediately redirecting, [ with the reliable action ], helps break the habit without risking rewarding it.
Relating specifically to dogs barking at the door, something was suggested to me a while back which is so simple I had never thought of it, [ I wish it was me came up with it
], and that is to teach a sit or a down with an additional cue geared up to the dog seeing people especially. The suggestion was to use the word `hello` as the cue for the sit or down. As we know, any word can be used as a cue for an action, so long as we use it consistantly.
My Gremlin for example, has two cues for sit, one which is general [ `sit` funnily enough
] and the other is for specific places - the extra cue being `kerb` which means sitting at the pavement before crossing the road on a releasing `walk on` cue.
Using two cues for the same action is not confusing to a dog when one is general and the other has a specific association.
So, using`hello` for a sit or down when someone is at the door [ with the usual rewards of praise etc while the dog is learning the cue, the same as any other ], can put a positive but calming slant on things for the dog. Aiding the reinforcement of it is that `hello` is such a common word, [ hence using it as a new cue ], when greeting people at the door, and them saying it back, helps reinforce the sit or down to give guests time to get in and take coats off rather than be pounced on in the doorway / hallway by the dog/s.
It can take some dogs a little while to learn of course, especially if a behaviour is intrenched, but by working through it consistantly, not trying to rush it, not putting pressure on the dog by having people knock at the door to test it out before the dog is confident and reliable with the additional cue, and not giving up before the dog has had time to take in the information properly, it can work very well indeed.
[ I so wish I`d thought of it, so simple but so potentially effective !!!! ].
To put right what is so wrong on the Borstal method as shown with the rattle bottle, the dog should never see the source of the sound, the sound should never elicit a fearful or worried reaction, and the sound should not be made more than once for each instance. I am not pro this method however I do understand its original concept and application which is why I know how misused it is on the programme and by one of the trainers on the Staffie whose owners binned the bottle immediately once I talked through things with them.
Incidentally, when he is excited [ he luuuuurrrvvveeesss his agility ], he does bark initially, purely from excitement as he wants to get going, [ he also thinks he is a collie in a Staffie body bless him
], and instead of his handler getting frustrated and telling him to stop barking using loud / harsh / frantic tones, [ which just gets many dogs barking all the more ], I told her to whisper very quietly. It did not take long for him to realise he could hear `something` and he stopped barking so he could listen properly instead.
I hope some of the above may be helpful in explaining the whys and wherefores of the bottle, [ the method originated as a tin with coins incidentally ], in its intended use, and how it is misused [ mostly unfortunately ], and how other sounds in conjunction with redirection and timing can mean the getting a desired behaviour without it involving apprehension, worry, or other negative associations which can cause a potential backfire.