Do hairy terrier coats like Frankie's count as double coats like huskies, malamutes etc?
(genuinely curious!)

Well apparently so, he'd certainly come somewhere in that list of Dawns

I'm with you. Lacey's own natural coat if left ungroomed,would literally be tripping her.Been at the groomers today and she looks pretty happy to me.Not shaved,just shorter!every shih tzu owner I know has their dogs clipped,can't all be wrong.

Don't think I know of one who isn't clipped and we've had tonnes coming through classes.

I'm curious about that list Dawn...particularly the Yorkie because isn't the other alternative to have time with their hair wrapped up in papers/clothes or whatever they do? Or is trimming ok but not full shaving?

LOL that was Tawney, Gnasher, wasn't it. She was a flipping nightmare with it, she used to literally walk off the boat into the water and after the ducks, then she stank, so we had to find a watering place where we could hose her, then of course she was sopping. In the end we gave in and she had a number 2. Luckily her coat grew back every winter, not something I would recommend normally though, but for us at the time and in that situation in worked!!!

Curious why? A Yorkie shouldnt have all its coat chopped off. People deliberately choose to do that to their dog therefore altering its natural texture. When it grows back its softer, not weatherproof and over time will become much lighter in colour as well. This is the same for 99% of the rest of them too. Clipping destroys coats and leaves the dog open to the elements and as the articles states, makes a hot dog worse.

I cant understand it personally. Instead of the sun hitting the protective guard hairs, the sun hits the skin. Why people think thats better, I dont know, but its a very regular occurrence in hot weather for many people.

Yup, I agree with you there Trouble - you know your dog, and if he is more comfortable with the locks off, then fine. As I said, my very good friend used to strip her Mal cross because they spent a lot of time on a canal barge and the dog used to keep diving into the canal and with a thick heavy double coat it was a nightmare. But it is true that the natural "wolfie" coat of the Mal is designed to stay cool in summer and warm in winter, and if possible, it is better to leave them au naturel as long as they are regularly brushed to remove the cotton wool undercoat, otherwise that will mat up and cause immense distress and discomfort to the dog.

I would say no. A true double coat consists of "cotton wool" type lining, which is shed constantly, with a full blown "blow" at least once a year. The upper coat - I believe these are called the guard hairs? - don't shed, and provide a waterproof upper layer like wearing a macintosh. It is a nightmare washing these types of dogs, as their coat is so waterproof it is hard to break the oily barrier, but really unless they have rolled in fox **** or are inveterate diggers (as many mals are!), then they really are best not bathed, esp if they are on a raw meat diet.

I didn't want to name and shame June, but now you've said it, yes it was of course darling Tawney I was talking about! I still miss her and regret what may have been ...

You did absolutely the right thing in giving her a number 2, in those circumstances you had no choice - I would do the same thing with my 2, as like Tawney they would just be constantly diving into the canal after ducks and other wildlife, or just for the joy of it. The boat would be filthy and wet, and it would just have not been on.

Borderdawn - I think for dogs that work outside or live outside it is important that they keep their coat natural as it was intended to be. However, dogs nowadays live indoors with central heating in the winter, or underfloor heating etc. My dogs breed originated from Tibet and their coat would protect them against sub-zero conditions with a thick undercoat. My dogs adore winter and the cold weather and hate the heat. I let their coats grow in the winter but have them scissor cut to about 2" to 3" in the summer and they are so much happier then (I would never clip them).

Very few dogs are left completely natural without intervention from humans. I assume you probably strip your dogs coat or are they totally left untouched with just a brush? I use an undercoat rake on both of mine to get rid of the dead undercoat which if not removed causes matts.

My opinion is that people should trim/clip or leave the coats of their dogs as they should know their dogs and their lifestyles best. I do agree however, that some people clip their dogs unaware that they have double coats.

I had Rucksack's coat cut shorter last summer (his coat was natural) when he suffered appallingly from an allergic reaction to Harvest Mites .... they are more manageable this year as I can spray the Frontline down to the skin.