I'm not sure about the deaf puppy thing - I think it is wrong to put an otherwise healthy dog down.

But no-one yet has answered my question at what age do you put a dog to sleep that does not conform to the breed standard?


I do agree on taking each dog individually, my girlie bouncing round here has a broken toe so no longer fit for purpose - whoever owned her did not pts they dumped her on the street and Im glad they did!

I so feel for you x Its heartbreaking and I know you will do right by the dog - thats all any of us can do.

[QUOTE=ruthshaw9;2138199]There are many dogs living happy healthy lives that don't meet their breed standards. In a top breeders litter there will be pups that don't meet the breed standards. I would even guess that there are more dogs out there that don't meet their breed standard than do meet it. I know a lovely Rottie who has a white diamond patch between his shoulder blades. He doesn't meet his breed standard. Should he have been culled?[/QUOTE]

It appears to some that yes he should of been - thats the bit I really dont understand! Ok if a dog has to have an amputation and you feel its the best thing for your dog that its life does not carry on I can just about understand. BUT for not being to breed standard that I cannot get my head around at all!

Its so hard to deal with but in those cases it is down to knowing and loving your dog. I dont think culling a dog because it does meet with the breed standard is in anyway near that.

I would guess spot , in answer to your question , at birth, if showing an obvious fault.

They would have done that with White Boxers, when it was the norm to cull them.

As for deaf pups, then I would think it would be harder to make a decision as you wont find out till later,

Something I would find extremely hard to do, but for those who do take that action, then for me, its their choice and their pups, and if they feel it's the best thing to do , then so be it.

Just to make it clear, in case thought otherwise, euthanizing for not meeting breed standard, is not something I would agree with , but health issues, I beleive a breeder has the right to make what ever decision they feel is best for them and their pups.

Cant see why a colour would mean being PTS unless there were health implications directly affected with the colour.

It really shocked me when i heard ridgebacks born wth no ridges had been culled ...
I did have a 10week old ridgeback pup with no ridge on my lap at the time ...

I was just making an example. One of the posters said several times that she would cull any pups that didn't meet breed standard. I can understand culling for health implications but not for not meeting breed standards.
I admit I am biased as I have a deaf Dalmatian. I don't see this as a health issue though. I do think a deaf dog needs a special home and not everyone would want one or could cope with one. I have no dog training experience, only training my own pet dogs. I do have lots of patience and I am totally devoted to my dogs though and I do live my life around them and am totally devoted to them to the extent that I won't even holiday without them. I only book in places where they can come too.
I can see both sides of the argument for culling deaf pups if the right owners can't be found. If it's a choice of a life in and out of rescue or pts then I would choose pts. If it were a choice between pts and a lifelong loving home with me then send your deaf Dally to me!

Sorry but just to come back to this bit - I understand what you are saying regarding amputation in large breeds for example but to me (and I think to you as well) SB saying they would cull any pup who does not come up to breed standard has nothing to do with large/small/giant breeds.

Thanks JB - I just wondered , not being an expert on showing breeding etc - how soon can you tell if the pups are not going to be show quality and how late would you (well not you obviously, I suppose the question is aimed more at SB) pts because the dog was not up to breed standard?

Basic construction can be seen at 8wks. The main issue from then on will be when they change their teeth, as nobody on this earth can say whether the bite will be correct when the adult teeth come through. The size of some breeds too.

Please note the red part of your original post has been removed as we do not allow personal attacks on the forum.

In cases like this it's best to remember to address what's been said, not who said it.

Except now what you've done is repeat it...which doesn't make much sense. *is confused*

I think [and I am sure someone will advise me if I am wrong] that there has been a wee bit of a misunderstanding with regards dogs not meeting breed standards and being culled

For the sake of it and just because its my breed we will use white Boxers as an example. No one has ever carried out a survey of any sort on what percentage of white pups are born deaf and to do it adequately it would need to be done world wide not just in the UK or USA etc etc Hypothetically speaking just supposiing out of 500 white Boxer puppies born, one of those is deaf, is something like that any reason for all white boxer puppies to be culled at birth. White boxer puppies do not meet the breed standard because of the white colour, white or checked [checked being Boxers like Katie who have largish coloured patches on their bodies, she has a dark brindle patch at the bottom of her back] but her main colour is white

Thankfully lots of modern day boxer breeders are coming away from the old attitude that just because the white or check pup "might" be deaf, we will cull it as soon as its born.

Now you could have two international champions bred together and they will have hypothetically speaking 6 puppies in a litter. If the breeder is lucky, they will get one maybe two pups that they can run on for showing. I have known breeders run on pups to 8-9 months before deciding that they are not going to do anything or much in the show ring, [in other words dont meet the breed standard for shows/future breeding programmes] those older pups are "homed" to pet/companion homes. They are not culled or PTS - think this is where there is a bit of a mix up/misunderstanding

Sometimes there is nothing in a litter that will be worth keeping for showing so all the puppies go to pet/companion homes

You see no matter how good the parents are with regards the breed standard there is no guarantee they will have show worthy pups themselves.

I showed dogs for a lot of years and I have never ever known any breeder put a pup or dog to sleep because it did not come up to breed standard. I cant speak for nowdays but I cant see it having changed that much over the years - again, I am sure there will be someone who will correct me if I am wrong

This thread originally started off as the original poster querying the age of culling if pups [any pups] where born deaf. Pups will be approx 4 weeks before you can take them aside to check if they can hear or not and the ethics of having the pups that long and then PTS if it was found they were deaf.