Well Done . Why didnt I think of that

Let us Know what happens

watched this for the first time last night. Still in two minds about it, and didn't really like some of the methods. I felt the problems were dealt with but not the cause of the problems. i.e the weimaraner. I may have missed it but I can't remember anything being said about the fact that it is a working Gundog breed with a high need for stimulation and exercise. was it ever really pointed out that the dog acted like it did because it was bored and under exercised. Surely the source of a problem should be thoroughly explored before any attempt is made to treat it.

The owner did tell Mic that the dog was walked for 2 hours every morning and I think Mic did encourage the owner to get involved in agility. He did also sit down with the owner on the first morning to get a run down on the dog's behaviour and interaction with its owners, together with watching video footage from their home

I do think that the basis of the issue with this particular dog was that he thought he ruled the roost - no fault of his own - just never shown anything different - and he had made vast improvements when they visited the couple 2 months later - A lot of dogs who believe they are pack leader and have not been given boundaries can be pretty unruly!

But I agree that it would be good to touch upon the traits of the breed and what they were originally used for to give viewers better understanding, just in case they are thinking of purchasing that particular breed

I think this really goes back to what's been said before - the programme is really there predominantly for entertainment and we need to bear that in mind - hopefully the BBC will be able to enlighten us all as to whether they are willing to accept a bit more responsibility, sometime over the next 24 hours!

I heard the APDT were going to make a complaint about the show as well ...

Hello!!!!
Not saying that Mic shouldn't have used the alpha roll, just saying I wouldn't have done but what do I know???? Teee heeeee!!!! He did what he did very well and professionally there is no doubt about that and it ended a difficult situation. Mic had to make a split second judgement with an unruly dog, his method worked and it was fantastic he went on to calm it.
To be honest I wasn't sure about the show in general this week, Mic's alpha roll was a very small part of that. I wasn't offended, just wondered about the methods more that's all.
Again as a few people have said, it comes down to it being an entertainment show not an educational one, BUT after last night, yes, the disclaimer needs to be more obvious and perhaps when something as visually radical as an alpha roll is used the trainer should be given an opportunity to explain it properly...
Perhaps, everyone,we want a show for people that know a little already about dog behaviour...perhaps we want a show that discusses training methods fully and shows how to do/use them???? Maybe we want more.....?????????
Still like the show though and still prefer it to VS, which I find is a bit 'fluffy' and lightweight (how controversial am I today???????Tee hee, I have SUCH a foggy lack of sleep brain I'm sooooo sorry!!!!)

I have to say, I am pretty shocked that some peeps think it's OK to choke a dog (because they have said the alpha roll was ok )- why? To me that is abuse.

The dog was gasping for breath as he got up. Is this considered OK?

The dog was not dominant - that word is just such an excuse for everything from pullling on the lead to barking to not being housetrained!! He was boisterous and had no training and had got out of hand - yes he was using his mouth but I saw no savage attack as such.

I think the peeps on the other forums are quite right. The show is frankly a disgrace and takes us back ojver 50 years.

What would Rob have done if the Golden had been a really heavy dog?
What would Mic have done if the weim had not submitted at all but kept coming back? j

I'm sorry, I've not been so mad for a long time. I can understand those who do not really understand the finer points of dog training supporting the programme, but how can anyone agree with choking any dog?

I'd make the point that there are good behaviourists and trainers out ther who train dogs like all of those so far shown with no overly harsh methods. If they can do it why can't the DB trainers do it?

The trouble I have with the alpha Roll is someone(wont mention her name ) tried doing this to one of my Dogs(without my permission,she just lunched her attack). And she F**k*d it up.My dog got the Better for her.She then Sh*t herself and Backed off.It has taken me and OH years to regain his trust and get to the stage were he trusts us and does not crap himself when ever he sees anyone that looks like the women, that done this to him.




The More I think about it I cant believe what a stupid/Dangerous move that really is.

I must say, I'm far from an expert on dog behaviourist etc but to me, the alpha roll seems very harsh - I'm sure there's other ways to gain respect from a dog than throwing to the ground and holding it in an almost head lock. Is that how you'd gain respect from another person? I think not!

Hi Wys!
I have to say I didn't think he choked the dog, any dog getting up from that situation would pant, it had been exerting itself and had been doing so since before the alpha roll incident. I wouldn't like to pass judgement on whether the dog was choked, I certainly didn't think it was when I was watching, but as I say suffering from brain fog.Hopefully Mic will be able to let us know on that one....I thought he just floored it.
I reserve judgement. I wasn't there...
As for the golden being dragged...nope, didn't like that, didn't like that one bit...had to hurt...how about tempting it along....?????? Nope not good that bit.
As for dominance...wasn't there a thread on this not long ago???

i think alot of people are anthropomorphisming the show.

dogs arent people and so what might seem harsh to us is perfectly normal for dogs.

its what happebns in the wild and it caused no harm to the dog.

therefore imo its ok.

i prefer these methods as it replicates natural behaviour and instills a long term reinforcement.

positive reinforcement doesnt always work and can just show a temporry effect til the animal loses interest.