register for free
View our sister sites
Our sister sites
Our sister sites
Our sister sites
Dibbythedog
Dogsey Senior
Dibbythedog is offline  
Location: Middlesex
Joined: Oct 2006
Posts: 834
Female 
 
23-02-2015, 08:58 PM
I usually say understand your breed but it depends on where you get your information. Forget what you have read about Poms , some of the behaviour like barking at strangers is due to poor socialisation and other breeds react the same way , my chi for a start .
This is your sweet puppy, try not to look at her as spoilt and manipulating .
Can ypu give us more detail . Is she your only dog ? Describe how you house train her , which room does sh sleep in at night ?
Reply With Quote
hairybabe
Dogsey Junior
hairybabe is offline  
Location: Devon, UK
Joined: Feb 2015
Posts: 30
Female 
 
23-02-2015, 09:25 PM
Originally Posted by Gnasher View Post
She wants to be with you though - to the point that she will wet herself if she is shut away from you; I can understand you not wanting her in the bed; how's about her having her own bed on the floor, or sleeping at the foot of the bed on top? Or crated in your room? You have the answer to the problem ... it seems a shame to ignore it, but I can quite understand how you are reluctant to have a dog in the bedroom. I was with my Hal but had to roll with the punches and allow him in.
She has always been in a crate in my bedroom, but she wets there. She has to actually be in, not just on, my bed not to wet.
Reply With Quote
Gnasher
Dogsey Veteran
Gnasher is offline  
Location: East Midlands, UK
Joined: Mar 2006
Posts: 8,775
Female 
 
23-02-2015, 09:46 PM
Originally Posted by hairybabe View Post
She has always been in a crate in my bedroom, but she wets there. She has to actually be in, not just on, my bed not to wet.
ok, i get the full picture now. This is weird. I need to think about this ... i'm flummoxed!
Reply With Quote
hairybabe
Dogsey Junior
hairybabe is offline  
Location: Devon, UK
Joined: Feb 2015
Posts: 30
Female 
 
23-02-2015, 09:51 PM
Originally Posted by Dibbythedog View Post
I usually say understand your breed but it depends on where you get your information. Forget what you have read about Poms , some of the behaviour like barking at strangers is due to poor socialisation and other breeds react the same way , my chi for a start .
This is your sweet puppy, try not to look at her as spoilt and manipulating .
Can ypu give us more detail . Is she your only dog ? Describe how you house train her , which room does sh sleep in at night ?
She is my dog. I have two others which are Shelties and never did these things. I house train her the same as all the other dogs I have had which were all Shelties. She has a litter tray which she uses when I go out reliably.

I usually train my dogs to use the dog flap when they are big enough to use it, so her proper house training did not start until she was three months old when she was big enough to get through the dog flap. She has been good today. No wees or poos where they shouldn't be, but one poo and one wee on the litter tray, the rest she took herself out for.

Problems occur still if she gets excited or if she plays with the other dogs to long (because she holds it while she plays then wees as soon as she stops wherever she is cos by then it is urgent).

I never has that problem with Shelties because they had less stamina and stopped playing after a very much shorter time when they were pups. She still shatters my 1 and a half year old! Since she has been around he has fallen asleep sitting up quite frequently. She never seems tired.

She has a worse problem at night with weeing. At first I took her out every hour, then every two, then every three. When I tried every four hours she started weeing her bed and is now nearly 5 months and wets her bed if I don't take her out every three hours still. However I know she can hold it longer because she held it eight and a half hours when I let her get inside the bed. Her crate is right next to my bed and she makes no sound, just wees.

She no longer barks at strangers except after dark, but now barks at places where strangers used to frequently be after stopping and going through her complete tricks repertoire first in a desperate attempt to get treats at those places every time. If I don't produce treats, she then starts barking at nothing.
Reply With Quote
Dibbythedog
Dogsey Senior
Dibbythedog is offline  
Location: Middlesex
Joined: Oct 2006
Posts: 834
Female 
 
24-02-2015, 12:36 AM
Thanks for the long reply , it helps to get the big picture.

Generally when I housetrain or retrain , I take the pup outside after meals and every hour or two depending on age.
I dont use puppy pads or newspapers at all unless its winter and the weather is very bad. I go out with them and make sure they have actually gone to the toilet
This is because dogs sometimes get used to going on certain surfaces such as carpet or puppy pads and find it hard to adjust to grass or concrete .

To recap , you have an indoor litter tray she still uses but also a dog door that she uses so perhaps indoors and outdoors is all one and the same thing to her when it comes to going to the toilet.

It sounds like she is isn't finishing going to the toilet outside. It could be because the weather is cold and she wants to get back inside or she's in a hurry to get the treat.

You need to go back to basics and supervise her more and keep to a strict schedule.

Weeing in her crate , she might not know how to tell you she needs to go out. Dogs dont like to soil their den but if they have to go they cant help it . If she has always gone frequently in her crate since you first had her then its become a habit or maybe she doesnt see it as her den.

What about her feeding schedule, what time is her last feed?
Reply With Quote
Dibbythedog
Dogsey Senior
Dibbythedog is offline  
Location: Middlesex
Joined: Oct 2006
Posts: 834
Female 
 
24-02-2015, 12:46 AM
Originally Posted by hairybabe View Post
Also she is trying to train me. When the phone goes, she competes for attention. If I dont give in to her, she will finally go to always the same spot, look me in the eyes, then wee, so I have to hang up and see to her.
What exactly does she do when the phone goes ? Does she do the same when you phone someone . The phone ringing often sets dogs off.

Have you tried putting her in another room or in the garden if its not dark or cold outside before you answer the phone?
Reply With Quote
Dibbythedog
Dogsey Senior
Dibbythedog is offline  
Location: Middlesex
Joined: Oct 2006
Posts: 834
Female 
 
24-02-2015, 01:06 AM
Originally Posted by mjfromga View Post
Try and make a small noise when you see her start peeing to stop her. Take her outside to finish when she does this, use a lead and guide her to the same spot, and then crate her. No playing, no attention. Perhaps she will get the association, if I pee, I get crated and it's boring.
Take her outside by all means but in this situation she wont associate weeing indoors with the crate and no attention etc , its too late.' there's too big a gap between the two. If she does finish her wee outdoors , she might associate it with that and you dont want her too. You want her to associate weeing outdoors with reward not "punishment "
Any rewards and corrections must happen very quickly for the dog to make the connections between the two.

One good thing is that this puppy isnt scared of peeing in front of her owner. Often pups will sneak away to wee or wont wee in front of their owners at all, they get put off very easily.
Reply With Quote
mjfromga
Dogsey Veteran
mjfromga is offline  
Location: Atlanta, GA, USA
Joined: Sep 2010
Posts: 5,680
Female 
 
24-02-2015, 09:13 AM
It's only something to try. I admit that it may not work. This is a tough case, indeed. Notice how I said perhaps she may link it. I realize that it very well may not work, but on the end of the rope, it may be worth a try. Who knows? I've not quite heard of a dog peeing all over seemingly only for attention. Seems really hard to stop.
Reply With Quote
Dibbythedog
Dogsey Senior
Dibbythedog is offline  
Location: Middlesex
Joined: Oct 2006
Posts: 834
Female 
 
24-02-2015, 01:01 PM
Yes it is tough! I understand what you are saying and I know you mean well because you care enough to take the time to answer and want to help.
Sorry to nag but it is important because whether its a treat or something negative , mistiming can cause problems and give the wrong message especially with pups.

This is why clicker training and using an ecollar is successful if used correctly because it marks the exact moment of the behaviour you are trying to reinforce or correct.

If anyone does have problems with a dog who doesnt get it, then have a look at your timing just in case that has something to do with it .
Reply With Quote
Dibbythedog
Dogsey Senior
Dibbythedog is offline  
Location: Middlesex
Joined: Oct 2006
Posts: 834
Female 
 
24-02-2015, 02:06 PM
hairybabe,
I dont think dogs are capable of having complex cunning plan but they do learn by experience and what works and what doesnt .
I think you have have a lovely bright excitable pup who is full of energy and like most dogs wants your attention and really wants to earn that treat. It might help to have treats that are not so high value.

Also , your other dogs might affect her behaviour , how much exercise she gets , additives and colourants in her food may affect her but how you behave can cause her to behave in a certain way so simply by changing the way you act wil help modify her unwanted behaviour.


Also she is starting to try to manipulate me over barking at strangers. I stopped her doing so by making her sit for a treat when we saw new poeple. Now at certain points on our walk where we most often met people, she threatens to bark unless I get the treats out even if no one is there.
If you are just passing by new people , I wouldn't ask her to sit , I would keep walking and not reward until they have passed and she is quiet, you can reward by praise and a stroke rather than a treat if you prefer.
If she "threatens" to bark than give a shrug and an ack or ah ah and carry on walking and not looking at her, ignore any barking . She will learn that a shrug and ack means No Reward . Ver important to ingnore the barking , she has to learn it wont work and she will get no attention .


She no longer barks at strangers except after dark, but now barks at places where strangers used to frequently be after stopping and going through her complete tricks repertoire first in a desperate attempt to get treats at those places every time. If I don't produce treats, she then starts barking at nothing.
Thats good she no longer barks at strangers , so time to reduce the treats to praise and attention if she doesnt bark . Again keep walking and ignore any barking .
Generally i would say dont let your dog practise barking but in this scenario , it really is best to ignore it and not give her attention , as gaining even negative attention is rewarding her and reinforcing the barking.

When a dog keeps repeating a behaviour you dont want, you need to think what is rewarding her , what is reinforcing this.

The Antecedent which is a “cue,” is anything that happens before a behaviour.

The Behaviour— how your dog responds to the antecedent.

The Consequence - What happens after . We all learn by consquences.


When the phone goes, she competes for attention. If I dont give in to her, she will finally go to always the same spot, look me in the eyes, then wee, so I have to hang up and see to her.
Here the antecedent is the phone ringing , the behaviour is "threatening " to wee, the consequence is you hang up and give her attention, you're reinforcing the behaviour so she will do it again.

So after the phone rings , you can not answer and ring back or put her out of the room first are a couple of responses you could make which will alter her behaviour .
Eventually she will not bother when the phone rings .

Maybe you could do agilty or clicker training to teach her tricks to keep her occupied and keep her brain engaged. Give her a way that she can earn those treats. earning treats will give her some sort of work ethic.

would love to see some photos! . Poms are very cute dogs.
Reply With Quote
Reply
Page 2 of 5 < 1 2 3 4 5 >


Currently Active Users Viewing This Thread: 1 (0 members and 1 guests)
 


Similar Threads
Thread Thread Starter Forum Replies Last Post
Puppy training while working full time...(house-training is it possible?) baieykalliboo Training 32 24-02-2015 06:09 AM
Crate Training/House Training, it just doesn't seem fair... LovingtheOEB Training 10 08-10-2010 09:16 PM
1 year old peeing the house after house training. I lubz Mini Schnauzers Training 15 18-01-2007 06:04 PM
house/crate training (house training setback, 5 month old started toileting in crate) The Charmed One Training 2 31-08-2006 11:42 PM
Potty Training Question (house-training - 8 month old doesn't ask to go out) divinity Training 2 11-07-2006 11:13 PM

© Copyright 2016, Dogsey   Contact Us - Dogsey - Top Contact us | Archive | Privacy | Terms of use | Top