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brenda1
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01-03-2015, 08:43 AM
It could be that her joints are hurting her as she is quite young. Goldens also lay down when being trained until they get to an age where they are happy to do all day long. Just do little and often over the day not all in one go.
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mocha
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02-03-2015, 05:47 PM
I have noticed yesterday ( because I was trying to figure out what I am teaching when she does do this) that while teaching her how to heel, she laid down after about 5 min into the training. I used the 'self help training K-9' video from you-tube. I didn't chastice her for this nor get frustrated yesterday, I just gave my release command and we kept going. Seems like when I am trying to have her obey during a commotion or distractions, (when other family members are around, or our cats) is when I get frustated because she will not listen at all. As far as her understanding what i want her to do, i am not sure how to tell.
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Dibbythedog
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02-03-2015, 06:04 PM
does she lay down when there are no distractions?
maybe you need to reinforce your training in a quiet place first .
maybe she just finds it over- whelming with your family or cats around at the moment.

i checked out the videos . Nice to see positve rinforcemnt being used.
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mjfromga
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02-03-2015, 06:31 PM
Not so nice if it's not actually helping to train the dog. If she keeps ignoring her owner and laying down, something is off. She will never learn like that. A way needs to be found that can help the dog focus. Distractions must be learned to be ignored.

When you call a dog or tell him to sit, he needs to do it, regardless of distractions. Now, a dog this age gets some leeway, she's not quite old enough to be expected to ignore distractions. But you've got to start somewhere. If she can't focus with distractions, lessen (but don't eliminate) them. See how she does.

Be sure to not give commands in a harsh or baby voice. Use a normal, level, tone. If she lays down, get her up. Offer a treat on command near her nose and say "Up". If it works and she bounces up for the treat, good. Teaching her to get up while being able to resume the training session, two birds, one stone.
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Chris
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02-03-2015, 06:58 PM
Originally Posted by mocha View Post
I have noticed yesterday ( because I was trying to figure out what I am teaching when she does do this) that while teaching her how to heel, she laid down after about 5 min into the training. I used the 'self help training K-9' video from you-tube. I didn't chastice her for this nor get frustrated yesterday, I just gave my release command and we kept going. Seems like when I am trying to have her obey during a commotion or distractions, (when other family members are around, or our cats) is when I get frustated because she will not listen at all. As far as her understanding what i want her to do, i am not sure how to tell.
Try breaking the training up a bit. A minute or so of heelwork, then a few sits, down, stay, back to heelwork - keep it varied. Variation often keeps the training interesting and there's plenty of time to add duration when she's more used to what's expected.

Add distractions slowly. Make sure she knows what you want her to do before you add any distractions at all. Also, when you do add distractions, do so in increments - perhaps one family member sat quietly at first, then have them move, then two people etc

Be patient. Remember it's all new to your girl. She's on a learning curve and we all need a bit of leeway when we are learning something
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Chris
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02-03-2015, 11:52 PM
One other thought, what type of heelwork are you teaching? Is it just loose-lead walking or competition style?

Competition style where the head is very close to your leg can put a strain on tender muscles and joints in young dogs so some discomfort may also be present at the end of a five minute period
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Dibbythedog
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03-03-2015, 12:21 AM
Originally Posted by Chris View Post
Try breaking the training up a bit. A minute or so of heelwork, then a few sits, down, stay, back to heelwork - keep it varied. Variation often keeps the training interesting and there's plenty of time to add duration when she's more used to what's expected.

Add distractions slowly. Make sure she knows what you want her to do before you add any distractions at all. Also, when you do add distractions, do so in increments - perhaps one family member sat quietly at first, then have them move, then two people etc

Be patient. Remember it's all new to your girl. She's on a learning curve and we all need a bit of leeway when we are learning something
Nice post Chris,
Dog owners often dont reinforce the behaviour thoroughly before they introduce distractions.

In this case , the pup isnt distracted in the sense she is running up to other people or chasing the cats. She is laying down as if she doesnt know how to handle the situation she is in and if she is feeling over whelmed then hopefully introducing one family member at a time while she is being trained will help her learn to cope.
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Dibbythedog
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03-03-2015, 08:51 AM
Originally Posted by mjfromga View Post
Not so nice if it's not actually helping to train the dog.
If PR doesnt help train a dog then why are you suggesting luring using a treat .


If she keeps ignoring her owner and laying down, something is off. She will never learn like that.
Yes, something is off or wrong. Unless we see a film of the OP and have more details we can only guess at why she is behaving like this but probably one or more of the reasons already suggested.
Training is tiring not only physically but mentally too.
We have very few details to go on about the dogs up bringing etc and we need to get the big picture.

When you call a dog or tell him to sit, he needs to do it, regardless of distractions. Now, a dog this age gets some leeway, she's not quite old enough to be expected to ignore distractions. But you've got to start somewhere. If she can't focus with distractions, lessen (but don't eliminate) them. See how she does.
Yes but set yourself up for success. Its a lot harder to build up realiable behaviour if you have shaky foundations, Having a good solid foundation of basic behaviour makes a huge difference. It doesnt take long to go over the basics, a few days or a couple of weeks isnt going to hinder any progress long term.


Offer a treat on command near her nose and say "Up". If it works and she bounces up for the treat, good. Teaching her to get up while being able to resume the training session, two birds, one stone.
Using a lure is very useful to show a dog what you want her to do or in emergencies. Its useful to teach your dog UP too.
But long term in this case, you want to pre-empt the dog lying down.
If you are trying to get your dog to heel and she keeps lying down and you keep luring her up, you're effectively teaching her to heel and lie down and get up again , you're chaining events together . Its very easily done and I've done it myself.
If she's tired or bored , you need to finish the session . By all means ask for a sit or something after she has got up so you can reward her and leave it on a good note but carrying on with the session when she doesnt want to or isnt able to concentrate wont help her learn anything.
Its not about letting a dog getting away with something, it about working with your dog and listening to her.
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mocha
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08-03-2015, 04:45 PM
this is all great advice. I have been reinforcing the basic behavior at different times during the day. She can sit, stay, lie down, heel, leave it, place, her name, sit/stay with release command. all on a basic level just the two of us alone. she needs more practice with leave it and stay with release command. she also seems to be a bit bored with the basic behavior training and seems to be ready for the next level. I have done a little training with distractions but sometimes have success and sometimes not.
I don't have much room in my house to go up next levels either. i live in Western MA and am my yard is snowed in.

for the heel....I use the K-9 video on You tube, but I don't have a big open space, inside my house, to do actually teach the heel properly until the snow melts and I do it outside but then, outside has lots of distractions too.

So, the background on Mocha is she was given to a family I know who has a farm, as a pup at 12 weeks. She is 9 months old now. I remember them having her last July. They asked me back in January if I could train her because they said that she would jump on people and chase their chickens. She has always been outside at their house and not trained. I said I would....I am no professional though and at times she can be uncooperative. She is ready for the next level. I just have to figure that out.
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mocha
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08-03-2015, 05:03 PM
another thing comes to mind too, is the owner wants me to train her to be able to be free off a leash and roam the farm while not going out into the street and to scare away any predators. (that is their long term goal)

I took notes from reply #'s 13, 15 and 17 and am going to experiment and see how it goes. Feel free to keep asking questions and commenting.
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