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chaz
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08-06-2010, 09:56 AM
I would say that the main problem is people are encouring them around homes, and encouring interaction between them, Foxes are a wild creature, and should remain that way, and if a wild animal has no fear, then it does become dangerous, but when people are feeding them, leaving out bins where Foxes can go through them, people are a food source to many if not all urban Foxes, no matter how small a part, when a wild animal not only looses its fear because its living closer to humans, and getting to know their strange behaviour and see a food source there who is to blame?

I've been around a few foxes, I've feed them, grieved for one (R.I.P Dale) I've seen some that seem to become more tame more easily then others, Tiny Tim was a fox with a genetic mututation, he has been brought up having humans provide all his food, Kimball lived with him, she too has had the same, Kimball became very tame, Tiny Tim didn't, it may of been to do with his little legs, but it may of also been in the mind, Foxes are very dog like, and like dogs have different ways about them, some are more calmer, some more flighty, the calmer ones however are the most dangerous, as they pose a possible danger to themselves and others.

What I would be concered with though is that yes Foxes are getting closer, they are getting braver, I saw a exterminator on the news this morning saying about how many times he's been called out because a Fox has gone into someone's house or garden, and mauled their dog or cat. If a Fox gets into a house and its a calmer more confident Fox I can imagine it wondering around, if you have no pets yourself, and are not wondering around, maybe the TV is on, I can easily imagine you not knowing that a Fox is in your house, if a Fox gets into a bedroom, and see's two vunerable children I can imagine it attacking them, and being a Fox, yes I can easily, easily imagine it attacking both.

But again we are too blame, I mean how many other countries would be encouring wild carnivores to come to their homes, either intentionally or unitentionally? Many would be doing all the can to stop it, but we see then as cute, fluffy woodland creatures, we enjoy seeing them, many people don't however see the teeth, see how they can become ill or injured and act different, and don't see the danger that they can posses to people.

Originally Posted by lilypup View Post
Interesting article.

http://www.telegraph.co.uk/news/ukne...e-experts.html
A few things I picked up in that article that actually makes it even more a viable thing that could of happened

They would be on the prowl looking around and if there’s an open door, even a cat flap, they will walk into houses and walk round and mess on the bathroom floor and sometimes sleep on the bed if the people aren’t around.

But I see no reason why a fox would do this, unless it jumped into a cot and then found itself with squirming children underneath it and couldn’t get out through the bars or something. I don’t know, but it just doesn’t make any sense to me.
So even he is admitting that a Fox could and does get into homes, but he doesn't see how they could attack a young and vunerable child, why wouldn't they be prey for a Fox, he even says that they are opportunist feeders, what gives them more of a opputunity to feed then finding itself in a bedroom with two young babies? We are too animals, and lets face it a baby would be easy prey to a animal.
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tinkladyv
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08-06-2010, 12:22 PM
Originally Posted by borderladysue View Post
The fact is these WILD creatures have had their death warrants signed and sealed all because as our towns and cities grew taking up their wild habitat. instead of discouraging them to take up new natural ground IDIOTS (humans) enticed them with tit bits thus encouraging them to stay in an unnatural environment making them more human savvy, and its the idiots who carry on doing this that has actually contributed to what is happening now. well i hope their proud of themselves.

Its us that cause the problems as you say, but actually i think they mainly feed off all the litter we leave. Its us that are the rats leaving our mess everywhere and as usual its our wildlife that suffers.
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Borderdawn
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08-06-2010, 12:36 PM
Did you know Foxes dont attack adult Cats too? They do you know. Somebodies back garden, urban Fox again, in broad daylight.

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tinkladyv
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08-06-2010, 12:53 PM
Originally Posted by Borderdawn View Post
Did you know Foxes dont attack adult Cats too? They do you know. Somebodies back garden, urban Fox again, in broad daylight.

Yes i have watched our two chased by foxes round here, its nature though.
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borderladysue
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08-06-2010, 12:53 PM
Originally Posted by tinkladyv View Post
Its us that cause the problems as you say, but actually i think they mainly feed off all the litter we leave. Its us that are the rats leaving our mess everywhere and as usual its our wildlife that suffers.
Yes they do feed from scraps left around by us but as it has already been stated on here people ARE actually feeding them purposely WHY? they are wild animals that belong in the wild in their OWN habitat NOT encouraged to integrate in an unnatural environment. most of these urban foxes die from road kill (you don't get a vast amount of this in the country side, their natural habitat) not a nice way to die i would say. What has come to the forefront now was just a disaster waiting to happen, and will these people stop encouraging these WILD animals into our towns and cities? sadly for the fox probably not.
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Hali
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08-06-2010, 12:54 PM
I know that everyone is shocked because a fox has never done this before, but I don't see how anyone can say 'foxes won't go for a human baby' with urban foxes as they are now.

When foxes were afraid of humans, I'd probably agree with that, but there is absolute evidence that many urban foxes are really not frightened of humans at all. So what magic powers does a human baby have that makes a fox not want to attack?

I'm not saying that every urban fox will, but if they are hungry enough, and/or bold enough and the opportunity is there, why not?

For those who still doub the story, I'm interested to hear what you think did happen. The only alternatives I can think of are
(1) the family did it themselves - I would've thought it would be fairly obvious whether the wounds were animal inflicted or not.
(2) a stray dog - possibility, but why would the family make up that it was a fox rather than a dog?
(3) the family were mistaken that it was a fox rather than a dog - again a possibility - I've had a pet dog that was mistaken for a fox by a child but these were two adults.
(4) their own pet dog attacked and they are trying to cover this fact up? I don't know whether the family has a pet dog - if so, I'd say this was a possibility, though I don't know any mother that would protect their dog at the risk of their children - i.e. if the dog really had done this, I can't imagine any mother wanting to keep the dog.
(5) a cat? Whilst I'm sure a cat could make quite a mess, the bites would be so much smaller and the wounds would be more likely to be scratches. And again, why say it was a fox - there would be no need to lie?

Any other possibilities?
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Borderdawn
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08-06-2010, 12:56 PM
Originally Posted by tinkladyv View Post
Yes i have watched our two chased by foxes round here, its nature though.
No, its not "nature" nor is it "natural" for a Fox to be A, out in broad daylight, B, for it to attack an adult healthy Cat, and C, for it to be in an urban well populated area.

They need culling in huge numbers.
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tinkladyv
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08-06-2010, 01:05 PM
Originally Posted by borderladysue View Post
Yes they do feed from scraps left around by us but as it has already been stated on here people ARE actually feeding them purposely WHY? they are wild animals that belong in the wild in their OWN habitat NOT encouraged to integrate in an unnatural environment. most of these urban foxes die from road kill (you don't get a vast amount of this in the country side, their natural habitat) not a nice way to die i would say. What has come to the forefront now was just a disaster waiting to happen, and will these people stop encouraging these WILD animals into our towns and cities? sadly for the fox probably not.
I dont think its as simple as that, i dont think the foxes are coming into our cities, but that it us that have taken away there natural enviroment and that they have now adapted to a city life. Im not convinced that because of one incident, terrible as it is that the urban fox is a bad thing.
Go and live in Australia and you might find a snake in your back yard. I know friends in Forida often get aligators in their swimming pool, so much so that there is a man who relocates them for a living.

I think we are now just getting hysterical in this country, we need to understand that our wildlife is an important part of our world and learn to live alongside it with respect, nature is very clever and we dont need to interfere...the urban fox is a perfect example of this.
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borderladysue
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08-06-2010, 01:08 PM
Originally Posted by Borderdawn View Post
No, its not "nature" nor is it "natural" for a Fox to be A, out in broad daylight, B, for it to attack an adult healthy Cat, and C, for it to be in an urban well populated area.

They need culling in huge numbers.
I totally agree, they cannot be kept in sanctury's or put back in the wild as they would not survive or just find their way back. they are a huge problem and the only alternative is mass cull.
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tinkladyv
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08-06-2010, 01:10 PM
Originally Posted by Borderdawn View Post
No, its not "nature" nor is it "natural" for a Fox to be A, out in broad daylight, B, for it to attack an adult healthy Cat, and C, for it to be in an urban well populated area.

They need culling in huge numbers.
To me it shows an animal that has adapted to an enviroment that we as humans have changed...a clever animal by my standard.
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