Dont know about the Aussie`s hips as he is also an agility dog and poor hips dont allow dogs to do agility well.

I do believe the worst thing to happen to the Border Collie breed was being allowed in the conformation ring as the beauty of the breed to me is the diversity of appearance and their natural brains. I hate seeing a line of what I consider `clone dogs` [ appearance wise ] in a breed which doesnt need a certain `look` to do the many jobs they are renowned for.

Dont know about the Aussie`s hips as he is also an agility dog and poor hips dont allow dogs to do agility well.

I do believe the worst thing to happen to the Border Collie breed was being allowed in the conformation ring as the beauty of the breed to me is the diversity of appearance and their natural brains. I hate seeing a line of what I consider `clone dogs` [ appearance wise ] in a breed which doesnt need a certain `look` to do the many jobs they are renowned for.

Bulldogs are a shameful example of poor health imo. One guy a few years ago bred some back to how they originally looked - taller, very healthy, able to scale a 6 foot fence as easily as other athletic breeds, [ I`m talking demo style as is often shown at displays with Alsations etc ], and the KC refused to acknowledge them iirc yet they were more purebred to how they *should* be than any you will see in a show ring.

If you look at many Alsatians in US show rings, they are cripples, travesties of the dog world.

Certain breeds are so exaggerated for appearance` sake, the health of the dog seems to be the last consideration. What use a fully functioning healthy heart and sight and hearing etc if a dog can do no more than hobble and sway almost uncontrollably as they walk, or has eyes which pop out when they sneeze ?

I did some Junior handling many years ago with my Alsatian, and he was pretty much laughed out of the ring by the adults at one show - his back was too level and healthy for the show ring apparently...


Its all well and good the show ring versions being,
[ alledgedly ], healthy but for whichever breeds do well in the ring and have careful a breeder doing their utmost to do every health and genetic test possible before they breed, and being careful of who buys the puppies, there are hundreds of money hungry charlatans out there ready to farm those breeds regardless of genetics etc and far too many people out there willing to pay those farmers for what they are churning out just so they can have whatever is the latest ` in ` breed or look that they saw on the telly at Crufts.

I think, when commentry is done, they should list the known health problems in each breed they are discussing as well as telling people the `plus points` to look for.

If I ruled the world :smt077 believe me there would be some changes in what dogs in show rings would look like and all unhealthy breeds would be banned from showing until they were bred back to good health and proper mobility.
[ Dachs, Peke`s and Bulldog breeders especially, take note ]

I was responding to the post I quoted

Odly enough many people class GSDs as a guarding breed-as in guard dog they are not they are a sherpherding breed & the only bad affect showing has had is make them too popular & encourage peole to breed from pets that don't fit the breed standard(as in white LC GSDs they could not work german sheep but the fancy that promote them are not show people)

I have no problem wth people not being interested in showing, but they breeds with now banned work(dog fighting, bull baiting etc etc)wouldn't exist with the show bench dogs. I do get tired of the general public thinking all show spend all their time being show dogs most don't mine looked beautiful & clean yesterday, today JD has been gardeing & mouse hunting & is a right little scruff ba again

I have a friend who does obedience with her Show bred Irish Setter, however when she exercises him as opposed to training he goes into gun dog mode & indicating all & every sort of game his mum btw is a full champion & was in her youth a working gundog !

You cannot generalie about breeds & sorry but it is the breeders who produce the dogs & some are toally kennel blind & when they judge they put up the type they breed In the UK most judges are breeders BTW

Show dogs as a whole have by definition to have good temperaments A nervous or agressive dog will never(in the UK)do really well. They have to allow strangers to examine & be in close proximity to other dogs(usually of the same sex) & behave This is why people are recommended to look for a pet from a responsible show breeder

I regularly see lots pet bred GSDs of very poor character & that to me says it all

Actually poor hips don't mean a dog cannot be agile & my working bred BC with severe HD(hip score-34:34=6never had a minutes problem with his hips & we did agility for fun most of his life

simple answer from me and that is NO breeds have not benefited from showing, staffords, british bulldogs, neos, blood hound, irish wolfhounds..... i could go on forever sadly

I think that is the difference. Kelly does agility for fun, only doing lower height "anysize" classes. He would still do full height if I asked him, although he would have to work harder at it. I know several dogs with HD that still compete at full height but you can see that they lack the power in hindquarters to push off for the jumps and you can see that they are working a lot harder. Just because a dog with poor hips will do full height courses doesn't mean that they should