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xxizmexx
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Location: Swindon, UK
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31-01-2011, 01:18 AM
Originally Posted by shaunclemens View Post
ill be honest thats confusing me very much. when he pees does he go into submissive position (head low start lying down)
Yes sometimes but more arched like he is cowering and doesn't WANT to be peeing. I always know when he is just about to, you can see it in his face and behaviour. Hes such a confident dog when it comes to strangers but then this I just dont get it.
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xxizmexx
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31-01-2011, 02:16 AM
Thank you everyone for replys

I havn't provided the most stable of homes, being 16 when I got him, I moved about quite a bit and didnt realise the affect my lack of 'training' was having!!
I guess I hoped that once I was settled I could find a trainer and get down to solving his issues one by one. But the Amicham Bonding trainer I paid to come to my house, ok he helped but he didnt spend enough time with him to really understand the problem we were having.
Originally Posted by ClaireandDaisy View Post
Assume for a moment that this dog is not `dominant` and look at what is actually happening,
He wants to go first. He is impulsive and poorly trained. This is not dominance. This is impatience and bad manners. Join a good (positive) training club and train him round other dogs.

if he sees (another) dog ..., I have to just stop and cling on for dear life.
Again, this is down to you, not the dog. He is under-socialised, has no idea how to interact properly with other dogs and is out of control. You need to find a good (positive) trainer and work on this.
Growling... I stand up and point to the door, saying firmly ‘out! now!’ A growl is a vocalisation. If a dog growls in play that is all it is. If a fearful dog growls it is a warning. Depends on the circumstances. Either way I would never tell a dog not to growl. It`s your early warning that you need to stop stressing the dog. Introiduce control into your play. Teach Retrieve. Ask for a Sit during a game. Ask for a Down in exchange for a game. The dog will learn sel-control that way.
He guards EVERYTHING! ... The most effective way of dealing with it has been ‘go, get out take it with you’ So in his eyes if there is something he wants, he is shouted out and rejected... but he keeps the prize. No. Teach a Swap then reward the dog

I recommend you read Jean Donaldson`s The Culture Clash and train your dog.
or Complete Idiot's Guide to Positive Dog Training by Pamela Dennison
or anything by Karen Pryor.
Avoid anything by Cesar Milan.
Your dog can be turned around but you will need to rethink the way you work with him.
Good luck.
Notice I used the word effective, the only effective way. Because the end result when he is growling and baring teeth at me or my guests IS to remove him from the situation. What else can I do? There is NO WAY I can swap with him when he is like that, it is not safe!

I try my best every day to ensure everyone is safe including Blitz and myself, because he’s attacked before as well, not for a while but he has.

I want to try more classes and things but to be honest I really can’t afford that right now, Im still paying off the cost of the last training venture. And I know he would completely ruin those classes for everyone around him and I dont think I could control him safely. Or should I put others in danger?

The weird thing is that although he can’t socialise with another dog, but he will let my 6 week old kitten suckle on him, if you look on fb at some of the photos you will see.

Most people who meet him first of all think hes a good dog, he sits he lays he knows his left from right and even gives high 5 and high 10. (not for free, only when you have a reward) but that means nothing when he’s attacking my dad, ripping half his finger off, putting him in hospital getting stitches. I doesn’t stop him biting a friend of mine only 2 days ago, oh and on xmas eve taking a chunk out a friends side because she shook my uncles hand when going to leave, and that guy who asked for a rizzla once... oh the list goes on.

I know its my fault and I know I can’t ever make it up enough but I am trying... Or I wouldn’t be here!
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Wysiwyg
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31-01-2011, 12:02 PM
Originally Posted by xxizmexx View Post
...

But the Amicham Bonding trainer I paid to come to my house, ok he helped but he didnt spend enough time with him to really understand the problem we were having.

...



I know its my fault and I know I can’t ever make it up enough but I am trying... Or I wouldn’t be here!


I have just read this again and I have to say that I'd not expect an Amichien trainer to be able to cope with these problems... they aren't erm, respected a lot within the dog behaviour and training industry.

You weren't to know - I imagine the advertising would be good and of course there are JFs books, too.

Look, I'm going to be honest. The way things are going, you or your dog may get into very serious trouble. He is biting and it appears he does not have much bite inhibition.
He appears to be fearful but also controlling (no doubt due to anxiety and learned behaviour) and he is around people a lot.

I think you need a proper good well qualified behaviourist now. I think this is pretty important as things are only going to get worse, because with the best will in the world, you have a difficult situation that may escalate at any time.

Please have a look at these and get proper reputable professional help and advice:

http://www.apbc.org.uk/help/index
http://www.capbt.org/findbehaviourist-uk.php

Best of luck, take care

Wys
x
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wilbar
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31-01-2011, 01:42 PM
No offence to xxizmexx at all, but I'm afraid that this thread just goes to show the harm that these so called trainers & behaviourists that use the outdated dominance theory & the silly "amichien" theory can have on some poor dogs & their unsuspecting owners.

xxizmexx ~ you weren't to blame for the things you've been told or read about on how to treat your dog. It just makes me so cross that these people can advertise themselves as "experts" on dog training & behaviour & charge such exhorbitant fees to the hapless owners, when all the time they just haven't a clue. It wouldn't be so bad if their methods did no harm (just did nothing at all) but they don't ~ they very often can make things so much worse!

Please take note of Wys's advice & try to get yourself an appointment with an APBC member. I know they're not cheap ~ but what price can you put on your dog's well-being & happiness?

I used to have a rottie/GSD rescue with very similar problems to yours. Sadly it all went very wrong for me & after he attacked my husband on a couple of occasions, we had to make the very sad decision to return him to the rescue where I know he was pts because I was his last chance at living in a home & he was too stressed & upset by kennel life. It was because of this dog that I started a course in canine & feline behaviour. And believe me ~ it was life-changing & made me look at animals in such a different way. It really is well worth getting some proper help from someone qualified by the APBC ~ without being melodramatic, your dog's life could depends on this.
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smokeybear
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31-01-2011, 02:19 PM
I have to say that I completely agree with krusewalker in that you have a relationship problem with your dog and, as you have had it since it was a puppy I would like to know why you are asking for help now, 4 years later? Is it because this dog is now frightening you?



1 A dog can only go through the door before you if you allow it, it is one of the first things I teach a puppy, no words are needed but just cause and effect, if the dog starts to go through the door, shut it. You can teach this in one session. None of my dogs are allowed to go through doors unless I say so, sometimes they go through in front of me, but this is because I say they can!

2 Leaving a dog outside a shop is irresponsible. This leaves your dog at risk of:

Theft
Attack (by people or dogs)
Making his own decisions on how to behave
Escape

Never leave him outside of the shops!

3 To be honest your behaviour has educated that the appearance of dogs = trouble. I am not sure how old you are but you sound seriously overdogged and I would not allow you to be in this position.

Tug of War is fine IF you know how to make the rules, if you do not, then do not start something that you cannot finish.

Are you aware that Rotties do “talk” and it is not growling, also growling can be a sign of insecurity.

Guarding

This is easily fixed, but better prevented; Mine! A guide to resource guarding in dogs by Jean Donaldson is very good.

Food- I feed him, NO one else

So what happens if you are ill, away etc? It is bad planning for a dog to be totally reliant on one person if it can be avoided. The behaviour of this dog around food is totally inappropriate and potentially dangerous.

[I]You are in fact far from in control of this dog, you are AVOIDING issues and areas of potential conflict because this type of dog is too much for you.[/I]

You need help, Christine Emerson is in the phone book and may be able to help you, she works from the DROVE veterinary hospital in Croft Road.

Seek professional help for this dog IMMEDIATELY
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xxizmexx
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01-02-2011, 06:39 PM
Just found Christine Emerson, and a price list, can’t believe it!
The trainer I got to come to my house before cost £465 just for a 2 hour consultation and a laminated thingy on Blitz. I’m amazed!! Shall book asap and update you all as soon as I have............

Thank you soooo much!

To be continued ...............................
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smokeybear
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02-02-2011, 08:50 AM
Good Luck and let us know how things progress.
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Wysiwyg
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02-02-2011, 11:17 AM
Originally Posted by xxizmexx View Post
Just found Christine Emerson, and a price list, can’t believe it!
The trainer I got to come to my house before cost £465 just for a 2 hour consultation and a laminated thingy on Blitz. I’m amazed!! Shall book asap and update you all as soon as I have............

Thank you soooo much!

To be continued ...............................
Well done, well done!!

Sadly I think you were "ripped off" before, but you won't be with CE.

Wys
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Moon's Mum
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02-02-2011, 11:46 AM
Well done for seeking professional help! You have got out of your depth and need an experienced person to show you how to handle it.

I have a friend who had an American Bulldog with very similar issues. They didn't want to pay for help and wanted to keep it private - which essentially ended up with them avoiding and ignoring the problem. The dog attacked people too many times and sadly Turbo was put to sleep a few weeks ago after attacking her dad

If they had got help earlier this may have been avoided. So I applaud you for getting help. Good luck, with s good trainer and hard work I hope you can turn this around and find your happy ending
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xxizmexx
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05-02-2011, 09:18 PM
Update - Below is an email I received from Christine .....

Hi Sonia
Ok, lets take these things one at a time. You need to prioritise the individual behaviours depending on what is the worst for you, than we improve that and then the next one (you never get to the end of the list as it has a radiating improvement to the little issues.

I’d love to help you. We will need a two hour assessment in your home to find the cause and then the solution. To reduce risk you will need to first train him to wear a muzzle and a headcollar (I can show you how). It will take time and, if you want professional support, money unfortunately – but you can often claim on your pet insurance for behaviour counselling
He’s not insured I’m afraid so it’s going to be the end of next month before I will get to see Christine.

But as she said, I need to prioritise..... I would say it’s the attacks that are the worst but does that not stem from the food issues or is this something separate?

Any input would be greatly appreciated!

Thank you muchly
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