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Trouble
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12-05-2010, 11:00 PM
It's not impossible with full disclosure of the facts to rehome a dog that has bitten, this is why she needs to try the Dobermann rescues given earlier, in the mean time a muzzle, dog gate and close supervision will be required, not impossible in the short term.
Brundog
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12-05-2010, 11:08 PM
i really feel for the OP.

Basically, I think full vet check and thyroid check would be my first inclination and with that in mind, contacting breed rescue on that basis.

I know of dogs who have "nipped" children but have been happilly rehomed as its down to the individual situation and the lead up and circumstances that the dog was in.

This dog has been in the home 6 weeks - was this the first time the dog and child had been that close or has this just occurred, if it hated kids you would probably know that within first few weeks.

I think the dog deserves to at least get vet checked etc before being deemed in need of being PTS>

No one on here was in the home and saw this happen and I think its very easy to sit here and say PTS when you havent seen the dog, the circumstances and know exactly what happened.

Hope the OP visits the vets and updates us.
Nicci_L
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12-05-2010, 11:31 PM
Just flicking through previous posts of the OP's first ever posts states the dog is two years old, on this thread states he's approximately four years old...So, not sure which it is...??

Originally Posted by kitty View Post
Hi everyone,

Apart from our family dog when I was a teenager, I haven't had my own dog before.
We have been lucky enough to get our very own dog, he is called Oscar and is a 2 year old brown dobermann, he is a rescue dog who was taken on by a friend about 12 months ago:
In light of the first ever post from the OP on this forum, I'd say it's probable they possibly know more about this dog than they are letting on. As going by that post it don't make sense, making the dog a typical young Dobermann male quite possibly ''trying'' his luck with younger members of the family in the home which may have been completely taken out of context by the owner
Pidge
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13-05-2010, 06:00 AM
I agree with the ones who say full assessment with vet and long discussions with breed rescue before considering pts.

From what I've read from you on here Kitty and on other posts the dog is not horrifically aggressive. He has clearly not been well socialised and trained, all of which can be worked with with the right home and is definitely not suited to a home with children, but there is no reason to believe that he cannot be saved.

When he bit, your son was stroking his back. It sounds like something has gone on around his back area before and your dog gave your son a warning bite.

He was aggressive with this, no doubt about it and is not right for your home, but there is more that can be tried that just straight off pts imo.

Also, re age. If you don't know the history of the dog it's easy to say he is two if that's what you last believed him to be, but then later found out it was more like four.
Vicki
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13-05-2010, 06:02 AM
Originally Posted by Ripsnorterthe2nd View Post
I totally agree with the bits in bold here. What we need to remember is

A) None of us were there so don't truly know what happened

B) It's very likely that the OP was very stressed and upset by the incident possibly leading to the view of events being skewed/blown out of proportion a little.

I can't count the amount of times I've seen two dogs really go at each other and thought to myself "OMG they're going to kill each other" only to find when they're separated there's not a scratch on either of them (and yes I know there's not a child involved but it's a uesful analogy!).



I can't help but think that if the dog really did have to be dragged off because it was wanting to seriously hurt the child, then it would've done the serious damage prior to being dragged off? If the dog was on top of the OPs Son and the child only recieved a nip then I have to say this dog actually sounds very tolerant and has hellish bite inhibition. It's highly likely the dog got a fright/was in pain etc and reacted the only way it knows how - shouting (considering it's unstable background and skin condition).

Now I'm not saying the OP is lying, but I think we do have to bare in mind that the adrenalin will have been pumping and in these situations things always appear worse. It's also very easy to become emotive when a dog hurts a child, all I ask is that people try and offer constructive advice instead of pulling each other to bits - it won't help the OP at all.

My advice would be to get the dog to the vets for a health check and then please contact the rescues you've been given the details of. It doesn't sound to me like this dog is worthy of being PTS - if it had really wanted to hurt your child he would have.
Great post......
Moobli
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13-05-2010, 06:23 AM
Originally Posted by Trouble View Post
I think most of us who were saying not to pts were saying try to rehome via one of the Dobermann rehoming centres with a full statement of the facts. The dog isn't in the right home and with the best will in the world she doesn't have the experience or the confidence to deal with the problem.
Spot on Trouble!
Hali
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13-05-2010, 07:57 AM
What a sad situation.

I'm afraid the OP made a dreadful mistake taking in this dog - not understanding the breed, not being experienced with dogs and not knowing his full history.

Personally from what we have been told, I agree with Trouble that it sounds more like the dog was telling the child off than an outright attack. But nevertheless it is a serious situation and there is no question of the OP being able to keep him.

I think in the right home he could probably be turned around, but the truth is, with the number of unwanted dogs already in shelters, the chances of finding a suitable home are slim. There are a handful of people on this forum that I think would've made a suitable home, but it is clear that none are in a position to be able to take him in and I think the OP will find this across the board.

IMO the OP should only rehome him if a breed specific rescue are willing to help to find the right home. Sadly it seems that their resources are already overstretched and if I'm honest, I would rather see this dog pts than another elsewhere who has a perfect temperament.

It doesn't mean that the OP shouldn't try all the rescues but unless experienced help can be found quickly, I feel she has no option other than to have him pts.

A very hard lesson learnt and I feel sorry for all concerned, particularly the dog.
Dobermonkey
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13-05-2010, 08:30 AM
Am not denying this is a serious situation but the 'but it bit his face!' for some reason seems to make this 'more' serious? Of course for the child it could have had serious repercussions ie loss of sight but im pretty certain the dog didnt choose to nip its head for maximum effect it just nipped the first bit it came to? What if the dog had nipped the childs ankle?

I totally agree that Kitty needs to not have oscar anymore under ANY circumstances irrespective of how much rehab he may get. The element of trust is gone on both sides.

There are homes where dogs dont come into contact with children (mine being one of them). My boy was never socialised with kids (my bad) and they quite frankly put the wind up him so I dont put him in a situation where he feels uncomfortable.

Kitty took Oscar in with the best intentions and i applaud her for that. It is a terrible situation for anyone to have to deal with and I hope that her little boy hasnt been too badly scarred mentally or physically.

I hope one of the rescues can find a space for him and get him settled and assessed by a vet/behaviourist. Some rescues do rehome dogs that have bitten.

I was bitten in the face (across my eye) when I was about 6 years old and still have the scar, i walked up to speak to a neighbours dog that was stood at the end of its driveway (no gates or anything) and it launched and grabbed me. there was no mention of it being put to sleep as it was my fault for approaching it, i didnt know any better but that wasnt the dogs fault.
Jackie
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13-05-2010, 08:43 AM
Originally Posted by johnderondon View Post
I wonder how many professional behaviourists would definitively advise on the basis of an internet post?
Probably none, but then thats not the issue.

Its all OK for us all to give opinions and judgments, on what should /would/can be done... from getting in a behaviourist to having health tests done or re homing the dog...ALL of which is not going to happen over night.

The bloods will take a week or so to come back, the behaviourist can take up to a month to get a appointment (good ones that is) the re homing centres , the same, along with a biting history , will limit who will take him. so what does the Kitty do, with a dog that she is frighted to allow near her 3 yr old till then???


Yes the poster made a mistake in taking this dog in, the previous owners should have returned it to the RSPCA..(an option for the poster) but they no doubt will euthanize it, so for me (and only me) I would take on that responsibility.

But I wonder how many of you who are advising all the above, would be comfortable with this dog in your home for the foreseeable future around your 3yr old


Its incredible how this thread has gone, the attack has been classed as NOT serious, because the dog only scratched the child's face... lets not forget a crucial point the attack only got that far because the mother was there and was quick to act... I wonder if the same consensus would be taken if the mother was 2/3/4 seconds later in intervening and the dog did a little more damage than a scratch.

The attack has been suggested , that the mother may have over dramatized the attack due to her stress levels

The attack has been compared to a toy breed that had to be locked away from visitors.. insinuating the toys aggression was far worse.


We dont have to live with this, we all love our dogs, and no one would put a dog to sleep without any conscience and thought...but the facts are the dog attacked the child, he may well have only been telling the child off, tell that to the child the next time or the mother when she has to take her child to hospital to have her child's face put back on, or worse.. (over dramatic I know) but none of us are stupid and know these things happen.

Yes I am sure there may be people out there who could take and deal with this dog.......... but how long does that take, would you keep a dog in your home for as long as it takes and put your child at risk.........I would not.

Early on in her post she said the dog was outside looking in wagging his tail, wondering why he has been excluded........ well sorry for me thats would be far worse than having him euthanized.

I will say it again and to make it clear, have not told the OP what she should do, only what I would do... and again......my dog , my responsibility!!!
chaz
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13-05-2010, 11:18 AM
I've just caught up with this thread, and I'm so sorry that you are in this position, it must be horrible, I do believe that PTS should be on the options though, as really how many people could take in a dog with aggression, and gaurentee that it would never be around another child again? As unless the person who would rehome such a case has kennels to keep the dogs in, and walks the dog on private land, I don't think anyone could garuntee this.

The first steps would be though I think to get a behaviourist in, ring as many rescues as possible, get him to the vets, and see where you can help, no-one can give the best advice over the internet, and this case I think really does need professional help. But whatever you decide, good luck with your descision.
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