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Location: UK
Joined: Mar 2008
Posts: 7,723
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17-05-2011, 10:17 AM
Originally Posted by Loki's mum 
Absolutely!!!!!! I must admit, I'm on the fence about coat testing. On the one hand, if an exhibitor can make their dog look better with a quick spray on the topknot, I don't see the problem, I just wouldn't like to see them how they are groomed in America and Europe. Incidentally, I don't use products on Rio's coat but I do use supplements to enhance it - would people say this is wrong too?
I totaly agree I could see the differences with the Westminster and the Crufts dogs and tbh most of the crufts dogs didnt look too overpresented - but at the end of the day if a little prep gives you and edge - wont people start doing a little more so they get more of an edge - and then eventualy we will be following America?
Originally Posted by Ripsnorterthe2nd
I'm not saying they're fooled by a haircut, but trimming away the coat to enhance the dog to me is just as bad at adding products to the coat to enhance the dog. Like I've said, excessive presentation/trimming/stripping in breeds that are meant to be current working breeds will end up with the coat changing in order to increase flashiness and therefore their chances of winning in the ring - this to me is wrong as the dog is no longer judged against the breed standard. ESS should have moderate feathering, yet until recently the fashion was for glamour and as a result the coat became ridiculous. Thankfully this is now being dealt with - the winner of Crufts was a brilliant example of a breed standard ESS.
Yes I was impressed with that dog in many ways - not least because the coat looked nice - not OTT
Also lets not turn this into yet another show/working debate - working breeders in gundogs have just as much to answer for as the show breeders, just for different reasons.
Originally Posted by Ripsnorterthe2nd
But dancing with your dog doesn't alter it's breed in the long run does it? My problem with excessive grooming is that historically it has shown that the breeds move away from the breed standard in an effort to produce big coats to increase the chances of winnig, which for working breeds is detrimental!
I was also under the impression that the "detractors" were from within the side of the show fraternity who have had enough of people trying to circumvent the rules, as opposed to people outside of the show world?!
saved me from trying to say it in about 3 pages of waffle
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Location: lincolnshire UK
Joined: Apr 2007
Posts: 591
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18-05-2011, 05:09 AM
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Location: cornwall uk
Joined: Oct 2006
Posts: 7,132
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18-05-2011, 07:26 AM
Had stayed out of this up till now but quite honestly as two people have now described the showing as a beauty pageant then if that is what it is I can't see that it matters what the dogs are shown with on their coats or how they are plucked, cut or anything else.
OTOH if it is meant to be a true representation of what pups produced by the dogs might look like and how much the dogs represent the breed standard then they should be shown as they were born.
rune
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Location: uk
Joined: Mar 2005
Posts: 18,552
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18-05-2011, 07:34 AM
Originally Posted by rune
As a very average dancing with dogs handler I am interested to know how I increase 'flashiness' ----please!
Even their poor dogs are forced to wear "costumes" sometimes, isnt that for visual impact?rune
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Location: uk
Joined: Mar 2005
Posts: 18,552
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18-05-2011, 08:25 AM
Originally Posted by rune
For your future information dogs in HTM are not allowed to wear costumes.
rune
Like pretty wrist bands etc? Or is that just "freestyle" and you are saying there is a difference?
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Location: uk
Joined: Mar 2005
Posts: 18,552
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18-05-2011, 09:11 AM
Originally Posted by rune
Dogs doing HTM---which includes freestyle are not allowed anything other than decorated collars.
rune
Visual enhancement?
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Location: cornwall uk
Joined: Oct 2006
Posts: 7,132
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18-05-2011, 09:34 AM
Originally Posted by Borderdawn
Oh decroated collars? Why would they decorate them Lynne? make them look "pretty" perhaps?
Visual enhancement?
Most people don't bother and just wear everyday collars or go without.
I wasn't aware that anyone had suggested show dogs collars didn't enhance the look of the dog----but how on earth that equates with pulling hair out of a dog or shaving its hair off I don't know.
I am so glad I wasn't disappointed in this thread
I am out of it now---you show crowd can argue amongst yourselves about the beauty pageants rules.
rune
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Location: UK
Joined: Apr 2005
Posts: 13,122
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18-05-2011, 09:45 AM
Originally Posted by rune
Well they'd look pretty silly with a christmas type collar on when doing a pirates routine---so it is to link with the music.
Most people don't bother and just wear everyday collars or go without.
I wasn't aware that anyone had suggested show dogs collars didn't enhance the look of the dog----but how on earth that equates with pulling hair out of a dog or shaving its hair off I don't know.I am so glad I wasn't disappointed in this thread
I am out of it now---you show crowd can argue amongst yourselves about the beauty pageants rules.
rune
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