ah I see where your coming from now,, yes poss a new listing would be good for other breeds not rec in the uk

Dogsey is a UK based forum which, while welcoming members from anywhere in the world is still at the moment a mostly UK membership, and UK is the home of the foremost Breed show in the World under which breeds recognised by the UK KC can be entered, so it makes sense to us it as the general reference point

JRTs do have a breed standard, and are recognised in the US and Ireland so the breed standard is also applied in UK by the UK JRT club for their Show`s and breeding standards.

No I did`nt mean PRTs - and there was me thinking what I put in an earlier post might give an inkling that I know the difference between the two including recognition status and Standards

We are not governed by the FCI

They are the same breed - some call them Alsatians and some call them GSDs as they have been officially known by both breed names, hence I used the name I call them by and with the other in brackets to cover both usages, [ as does the KC except they have the bracketed name the other way around ]

No, that`s not what it comes down to at all, I think you misunderstand. To be a breed, the dogs have to have been bred type to type for so many generations, must have a Breed Standard, etc etc. A dog can be a purebred, [ therefore of a breed ], without yet being formally recognised through meeting the criteria set out by a KC or the FCI.
JRTs are recognised in the US and in Ireland because they met the criteria to be recognised - I have said why I believe the UK KC won`t recognise them, [ which I think is wrong of them personally ].
Border Collies are recognised here but not in Canada.

Recognition in the way most consider it is whether or not they are formally KC recognised and therefore eligible for Showing and going on the Breed register, that`s not the same as them not being a breed at all

I do see what you are saying, but I don`t understand why you feel its an issue but I do think it could be that you misunderstand the process of when a breed becomes recognised so hopefully my explanation has cleared it up for you, [ though I doubt it will have as I`m not good at explaining things ].
Perhaps the best explanation is how I word the criteria for the virtual class for Unrecognised breeds - that they have to be established purebreds, in other words `bred to type` over many generations.

It is the fact that we use the KC lists that I find the anomaly, with the cross breeds I think any one with a cross can call it a cross because that is what it is, if it is the recognised bit you are disputing then ok I don't find that side of things a problem as each individual will either recognise it or not depending on their experience. It is just the classifying of ancient recognised breeds as non recognised that bothers me.

Other sites may but we are not other sites and I think we should treat all dogs the same no matter their country of origin or popularity the fact that they are not popular in the UK and therefore not listed for showing in the UK should not effect the way they are treated on this site.

We are not governed by the FCI
We are not governed by the KC either are we?

When you consider that the BC is one of UKs oldest established breeds yet only relatively recently formally recognised by the UK KC, it just goes to prove that there is`nt necessarily logic to it all

Amen to that

But that`s the point - on here we do treat them all the same, that`s why crosses and unrecognised breeds are right up there with the recognised breeds in the breed section and not ignored or in a different forum section

I meant as in UK regarding which breeds are or are`nt recognised, for UK owners its the UK KC we are under for Showing etc, not the FCI.

But for the Virtual Show, well that`s governed by.... me ... so I can makes any rules I likes to make sure everyone gets classes which give them equality and treated with the same level of respect as each other whether purebred, crossbred, recognised, unrecognised, and where else would a cat get an honorary Virtual Award in a dog show like we had in the 2007 show

Erm....... I thought a lurcher was ment to be a whippet cross, sure I read that somewhere,,,

My last word:

Exactly but why not?

I think you're making a big fuss about nothing. You seem to have created an issue that doesn't exist. You're saying that we shouldn't use the KC method of recognition but the FCI, well the FCI doesn't cover all countries either nor indeed all breeds so the problem you see with the KC recognition issue will be the same with the FCI for some breeds as well.
Becky

What about one of those 'sticky' [note] things to say that unrecognized means unrecognized within the UK - as we are a UK site - But that it doesn't mean they are not recognized elsewhere?

A Lurcher is a cross of any sighthound with any other breed and in any percentage
Also, usually generally classed as Lurchers but have another name of Whirriers are Whippet x Terrier, maybe that`s what you were thinking of ?
Then there are Longdogs which are a cross of any two different sighthounds.

Because there is such diversity of which breeds are involved, there can be no `standard` therefore they are a `type` but can never be a Breed, hope that explains the Lurcher side of things

Incidentally, [ for Pita ], in our Show all established but formally unrecognised breeds can be entered in the general purebred AV classes, its only the Show Posed ones which are about recognised Groups in the main that they have their own class as do crossbreeds, [ because I was not prepared to leave them out ], but other than that one class type they are accepted as purebreds in our show regardless of KC recognition or not, so hopefully that expresses that they are indeed given the same respect and equality as recognised breeds here