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Location: South East UK
Joined: Mar 2005
Posts: 27,437
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29-10-2008, 06:49 PM
Originally Posted by Jackbox 
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Your welcome to your opinion, but my statement was serious... as Melzy is the one pointing out we dont own animals, nor should we interfere with in their lives...
Simply pointing out, dogs as other animals dont have a choice they live by our rules , and as most people purchase there pets..i.e paying money, which constitutes ownership, you can hardley say that you dont own them.
Then that is what she should have said!!!
Spot, I think you may have the wrong idea on deer culling......your imagination could`nt be further from the truth .
Foxhounds chase Foxes.... they do not chase deer nor do you hunt them down with horses, not in this neck of the woods anyway...they do hunt deer with deer hounds north of the border though.
But mostly in the UK, they are stalked..(on foot )
Not sure if there are any hunts in Exmoor or the New Forest who operate that way.
When controlled culls are in operation....firstly they will close the park to the public..(that includes me)as it is private land.
They operate in early mornings... they use professional marksman.... who can take a clean shot and bringing down their target. they take a natural selection in the culling.. the old, weak, young males.
It is a necessary evil in land management for the welfare of the land and the animals living on it.
I know they where culling that day, as I , as usually take my 2 for their daily walk in the morning...the park was closed, with park attendants on the gates...it did not take much working out what was going on, as the deer had become overpopulated....
As a whole they are a very well managed healthy lot... the estate works well in looking out for their welfare, and it is not taken lightly when they need to be culled.
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Location: UK
Joined: Apr 2005
Posts: 13,122
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29-10-2008, 06:55 PM
Originally Posted by Helena54
I for one, have no problem with any of the above. It's necessary, it helps the herd, it's done totally professionally, it's on a managed estate. I only have a problem when they chase the poor things until they're totally exhausted, just like they do the foxes - why do they DO that???!! Hopefully they don't anymore, but yes, I think the deer hunting still goes on on horseback in the west country, but don't quote me on that!
But I think the difference between foxes and deer is the size... a deer is hard to miss, Foxes on the other hand are wiry little creators... a much smaller target to hit with a clean shot... maybe thats why so many who are shot suffer long lingering deaths..
I also think the reason behind the two species being hunted are different... deer need to be controlled for their own survival ..where as the fox need s to be controlled for the survival of others
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Location: Scotland
Joined: Nov 2005
Posts: 19,298
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29-10-2008, 06:56 PM
Originally Posted by Helena54
I for one, have no problem with any of the above. It's necessary, it helps the herd, it's done totally professionally, it's on a managed estate.
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Location: UK
Joined: Apr 2005
Posts: 13,122
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29-10-2008, 06:57 PM
Originally Posted by spot
There you go again being presumptous, however I think you've made my point better than I could. When it has to be done it is done clinically, cleanly and not with a bunch of whooping monsters just in it for the fun - thank you.
Would that be the fox , you are talking about
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Location: Runcorn Cheshire UK
Joined: May 2008
Posts: 4,480
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29-10-2008, 07:02 PM
Originally Posted by spot
Arh right so saying that animals have a sense of humour and kill things just for the fun of it and to annoy us is not giving animals characteristic of human behaviour.
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Location: grangemouth for the moment
Joined: Apr 2006
Posts: 14,890
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29-10-2008, 07:04 PM
so I cant think of him losing a lamb to foxes
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Location: uk
Joined: Mar 2005
Posts: 18,552
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29-10-2008, 07:10 PM
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Joined: Apr 2005
Posts: 1,724
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29-10-2008, 07:12 PM
Originally Posted by Jackbox
Would that be the fox , you are talking about
You said there was nothing better than watching the hunt doing its tiny bit towards elimating these monsters I just wondered if you would enjoy watching the deer being hunted in the same way.
I also enquired if its just for control why are all the hangers on trailing round the country dressed up like ruddy clowns?
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Location: South East UK
Joined: Mar 2005
Posts: 27,437
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29-10-2008, 07:30 PM
You said there was nothing better than watching the hunt doing its tiny bit towards elimating these monsters I just wondered if you would enjoy watching the deer being hunted in the same way.
I also enquired if its just for control why are all the hangers on trailing round the country dressed up like ruddy clowns?[/QUOTE]
It's all part of the big act Spot, the Hunter welly hooray henry briggade (of which again I'm ashamed to say I used to be one of, but ONLY for the Port and Brandy we used to drink in the back of the R.R, and yes, with the Hunter's hanging over the back too!!!
) Now we're left with the d*cks on horseback wafting around sipping their stirrup cups before the "off", but what is the point in it all now if they can't do what they were there to do in the first place then??? Apparently, they can't give it up, the kennel staff, the huntsmen, the whippers in etc. would all be out of work, the fantastic hunter horses can be used for nothing else
and the dogs would have to go So they now carry on the hunts twice a week for the exercise of the dogs they don't chase the foxes (but I know different!)and it's oh so just not the same fun when you have a man laying the scent for the dogs to follow, BUT, having been on a draghunt myself (man laying scent, no fox!), it was far, far more exciting, exhilarating and darnright suicidal than any fox hunt I'd ever been on I can tell you that!!! Hopefully, they all might come to the same conclusion in the future now that it has been banned, so that nobody is out of work, none of the horses are pts or come to any harm, and they continue to use the hounds and nobody will worry about them enjoying their sport, BUT, it's not the same for them, they love the thrill of the chase, they love the blooding ending too, so I'm absolutely sure they still find loopholes from which to get their kicks!I have to admit, I'm talking 15 years ago here, I am NOT up to date with the latest on any of this, except that some of my old pals still hunt with the local hunt and I got to know a few bits and bobs after the so-called ban, plus I've seen the antics of the anti's when the hunt has set off locally (they have one in my village in February)so if they're not up to no good then why are the anti's avidly following their every move?! They must be!!!
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Location: Runcorn Cheshire UK
Joined: May 2008
Posts: 4,480
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29-10-2008, 08:13 PM
http://www.league.org.uk/content.asp?CategoryID=1712
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