I apologise as I have not read the whole thread, but I just noticed that shock collars have been mentioned, and wanted to state that I personally think they are a terrible thing that can and does get abused, I have recently been the witness to the euthanasia of a dog that was completely mentally tortured by the use of shock collars in fact he had three of the dammed things on his neck set to automatically go off if he made any noise, he was also an outside dog that was chained to a tin shed and had no way of escape from his torture, RSPCA were actually called out to see this dog apparently and because he had food water and shelter did nothing, the dog eventually became so aggressive he could NOT be rehabilitated, he was ALSO extremely hand shy which indicated that this dog was given the "odd clout" prior to the collars being placed onto him as the "odd clout" did not get the results the owners wanted. I am not soft with my own dogs (I cant be they would rule the roostand be totally out of control if I was) but I do not agree with hitting dogs or using methods of pain to train my dogs. yes I have many years ago given my dog a quick slap but that was more of a reaction type of thing and did nothing to improve the dogs behaviour it just satisfied MY need to "teach the dog a lesson" to no avail did the slap hurt the dog NO did it teach the dog that I was out of control YES and I lost a little respect from the dog because of it, I have learnt over the years that there are better ways of getting a dog to do as I wish than trying to hurt the dog, I dont agree with having a nanny state whereby all things have to be PC correct, but I have learnt that some things have improved over the years and positive reinforcment is better than heavy handed bully training, a dog will WANT to do more for you if you make it pleasurable rather than the dog HAVING to do something otherwise it will be punished. JMHO

mo

Oh! Mo that was such a sad story.

Mo there is extremes in every scenario, hitting shock collars prong collars choke collars, you name it and the odd idiot human will find a way to abuse it...I can't stand to see a dog being pulled dragged tugged at, with a collar and lead on, in certain situations that can be called abuse too.
Inka doesn't know what a raised voice is, Toro does, but I hate using that sort of tone with them, I feel guilty, all dogs are individuals , what works for one may not work for another...e collar, vibrate works , beep works, and as a reinforcement the nick works, these collars are preset to cut off , you can't damage the dog with them...they are factory set for the safety of the dog, knowing how some idiots would try to use them.

I live on dartmoor where sheep ponies and cattle roam free it is not farmers land it is common land which the farmers have grazzing on. I like to walk and cycle on the moor which I live on I am hardly going to drive my dog into the local town to walk it on the street. I never set foot in a field or on farm land apart from when I go to my sisters dairy farm that is.

Can I also ask if you have ever felt the shock from a ecollar ?

That is such a sad story. But some people will abuse with any method thats the way some people are but banning shock collar won't stop people abusing their dogs.

you can't damage the dog with them
these collars are preset to cut off , you can't damage the dog with them...they are factory set for the safety of the dog, knowing how some idiots would try to use them

I am not lying about the level of this dogs mental state, nor about the number of collars on him, so something has gone amiss, because they DID "damage the dog" BTW these were not the electric shock collars they were spray shock collars. and for information I saw the same dog 12 months earlier when he was just a cute wagging the tail typical 6 month old with no aggression issues, a total contrast to how he ended up.

Mo

Oh please...... Factory preset so it doesn't hurt...I ask you. Did you just read Mo's post?
Of course it hurts, that's the whole point.

no it wont but it will take another instrument of abuse out of their hands. I cant see how people can say (and this bit is about electic collars) that they are acceptable, they are part of the lazy attitude in society with regards to putting time in training correctly. this is my opinion and I accept others may have their own opinion on the matter, but I am afraid no amount of post will justify these collars to me.

sorry needed to edit my previous post, two of the collars were spray the 3rd I beleive was an electric one.

Mo

mo

I agree with this, I was talking about actually smacking a dog

I don't know where I stand on shock collars - I'd have to try one on myself before I tried it on a dog. I do use a water squirt bottle on Bryan though. Works eally well as he hates water.

I agree that they are a lazy way of training I used mine for chassing of live stock only. I used reward based training for everthing else and only used the shock collar when he wasn't reseptive to any other training regarding the sheep.
I felt it wasn't something I could take a chance on. And am glad that it worked so effectively without torment or torture to my dog it is not something I enjoyed doing or would do to every dog put i do think they do have there place used correctly.