The two latest comments echo my sentiments exactly!!

I do hope you are wrong though Nursey, as this would be shame on us as Dogsey members for the way we 'greet' newbies

This is what I am trying to say to you all!!

My point exactly to anyone else is that we have never asked anyone, let alone another Dobie exhibitor to show their dogs teeth with correct bite!!!

No other Dobie enthusiast (or anyone else asking for critique unless someone can prove me wrong and I'll happily say heads up I am wrong!!! )

If a dog is not your type, you should critique it accordingly in a fair and constructive manner. Otherwise don't say anything at all is my opinion!!!

I agree to disagree on what is our own 'personal type', but please can we not do this in a positive manner that is PC?

I do hope you are wrong Nursey and Bilclarie hasn't decided to slope off never to be seen again This would be shame on us as Dogsey members if it were to be the case!

The whole idea of this section is for people to look at /learn about / enjoy dogs belonging to other members.

It is one dimensional arena not a substitute show ring, no one no matter who they are can really tell what a dog is like without putting their hands on it and seeing it move.

I hope no members will be put off posting in this section in future many of us here are content to look at their dogs and enjoy them without comment.

Totally echo my sentiments Meg

I know sod-all about Dobies (but know what pleases my eye so-to-speak)

Totally agree with your comments and is what I have been trying to convey in my posts, only you have put across more eloquently than I

I agree with you to a point Malady - however, would you be 'unoffended' if someone said you would be "laughed out of the ring" in another country? Or - that you had "butchered" your dog? I for one would not be so forgiving

That was my whole point about us having constructive critisism on these critiques!!! Totally agree that there should be nothing to hide so to speak,

The points Colin and others have made regarding teeth/bite etc may well (or not) be valid, but these other comments are just plain inflammatory!! I have to also say that I have seen NO other Dobie critique asking to show the dogs bite and wonder why not?

Probably because there wasn't a questionable jaw line in the previous dogs shown here and therefore no need to ask !

Just the same as if I was in the ring with one of my dogs, and I was asked to 'go round', if the Judge thought something wasn't quite right, they would probably ask me to go again, to which I would, as I would want to prove my dog. I wouldnt be offended, I would want to make sure that my dog was looked over properly before being given a final critique.

If I wasnt prepared to have my dog thoroughly checked I wouldn't show it at all, or ask for a Critique in the real world or the virtual one, it comes with the territory.

I think what you are missing the point here is the inflammatory remarks made previously in the earlier replies

Statements saying things like the dog has been "butchered" and it would be "laughed out of the ring" are totally unacceptable in my book and non-constructive as criticism also.

Please see earlier comments from Fluffybunnyfeet and Colin and you will see what I mean.

As for jaw-line/bite - anyone else who has asked for a critique how owns a Dobie must have had an unquestionable jaw-line before now then huh?

With regards to asking to see the bite of this particular dog, there of course is nothing wrong in asking as a general enquiry - what I do see wrong is that is it the exception to the rule.

There have been FOUR other Dobies critiqued on here (not to mention several other dog breeds) and not ONE of them have been asked to show thier dogs bites is the only point I was making.

In fact, some of the other critiques that have been posted are far less detailed and close-up from this one judging from the pics

Whilst I can totally appreciate that (as is in life) this particular dog is not to everyones taste, I do feel that the critiques written by some members can be put across in a far more educated and constructive manner.

That is the sole point I was trying to make!!!

So what ? I don't see the problem. The OP posted her dog in a CRITIQUE section. Not a 'Look at my dog, isn't he pretty, only say nice things about him' Section !

Some Critiques are lengthy, some are vaguely 2 words, as my entire breeds was, for Crufts ! Some Judges have little to say, some say a lot, some think certain points are important, others don't.

You're missing the point here. THIS is a critique section, and although people should refrain from inflammatory remarks, they are free to critique the dog in a manner which is respectful, the OP can understand, take on board, and think about if they so wish to do so, that's what the section is for

Firstly let me start by saying that I have no problem what so ever if the OP wants to put up a photo of Merlin’s bite, because if I’m wrong then I would be only to happy to apologise to both Mo and Dawn, as I sure Dawn would be if she is wrong. Because I found out a long time ago that no one is perfect in this world and we all live to learn something new every day, but as I keep saying my coments are only my opinion based on the photos supplied by the OP as I haven't seen the dog in real life.

Now just to let everyone know that in all European countries (except here of course) Dobes are require to achieve a Schutshund (I think that’s how you spell it) title before becoming a confirmation champion and before the dog’s offspring can be registered, in order to maintain the working traits in working breeds such as Dobes.

Besides serving as a test for workability, Schutshund has also become a very popular sport, and there are three levels at which a protection dog can title: Obedience, Tracking, and Protection.

The judge scores this phase based on the dog’s control under the handler and courage overall.

Now the conformation part is related to the breed standard.

The European Dobe conformation states the following as a basic fault, and I quote: “Any departure from the foregoing points should be considered a fault and the seriousness with which the fault should be regarded should be in exact proportion to its degree”.

Now under coat, it states the following: Coat: Markings too light or not sharply defined; smudged coat or markings; mask too dark; big black spot on the legs; chest markings hardly visible or too large; hair long, soft, curly or dull. Thin coat; bald patches; large tufts of hair particularly on the body; visible undercoat.

Now as we are both agreed that Merlin has either a smudged or patchy coat depending on your point of view, and I also believe Mo herself has admitted this somewhere in the thread, then he can’t be faultless, can he? I was always believed that to get an excellent 1 for overall confirmation, dogs had to be flawless, which is obviously not the case.

Dawn are you sure you are not talking about the Schutshund test as you asked what conformation faults you consider wrong in Merlin and the conformation as I said above is in direct relation to the breed standard?

I understand that critiques are for the realist and not just to boost peoples egos Malady. Albeit, that I am a relative newbie in showing (started with GSD about 10yrs ago) I still class myself as newbie I am delighted that you also agree with my WHOLE point that this thread should NOT be inflammatory, which is a good thing
I also feel post should not to be borderline abusive and non-constructive, which is the point I have tried to make throughout this thread!

By very definition, we will all have our varying opinion on what is (in our opinon) right and wrong about a certain breed.

However, when a member asks us to critique their dog it ,must be done so in a constructive manner. I am happy to see that what you have highlighted is what we agree on ie:- "So what ? I don't see the problem. The OP posted her dog in a CRITIQUE section. Not a 'Look at my dog, isn't he pretty, only say nice things about him' Section !

Some Critiques are lengthy, some are vaguely 2 words, as my entire breeds was, for Crufts ! Some Judges have little to say, some say a lot, some think certain points are important, others don't.

You're missing the point here. THIS is a critique section, and although people should refrain from inflammatory remarks (in your own words) they are free to critique the dog in a manner which is respectful, the OP can understand, take on board, and think about if they so wish to do so, that's what the section is for "

I'd like to see a Champ Show Judge that would say such things yet!!!

That's why I didn't say a Champ show Judge, I said This is a Critique section, and that's what this section is for