I'm afraid you've trained them too mate, well, more sorry.

Yes, as I thought, 'reasonably responsive'. I find my male Akita to be 100% responsive to recall through positive training methods, it took over a year to fully achieve but we got there, and our trusting bond was never weakened...

Put an e collar on my female (who we are currently training) and she'd stick two fingers up at you and leg it..

I don`t think `Adam Palmer` has ever trained an Akita. I see he has managed to hijack the thread again though.

If not already mentioned, is there a riding school near you?
did a quick google (i appreciate london is a big place )

http://www.google.co.uk/search?hl=en...=&oq=&gs_rfai=

i would imagine most of them would have an indoor arena, surfaces would be less harsh on your dogs feet. A stables near me hires the school out for £7 an hour. am guessing it would be more than that in London but perhaps early mornings/late evenings when the nags are tucked up in bed?

When your dogs old enough cani x would be an option? or maybe even get the kit now and do some short jogs now and again?

Why do you always need to use an e-collar? Have you ever tried to use positive methods on dogs or do you hurt them to get the quick fix reaction/response then try to con the owners that their dog is trained?

Are you a qualified trainer? Or are you just claiming to be one? What exams/assessments did you take? What organisation would advocate using an e-collar in dog training?

Excellent post.

That's what I thought too.

My lot would walk off in a huff - and I'd be right behind 'em (assuming I needed someone like that to train them).

It's painful, therefore it is cruel. Are you able to use other methods? If so, what other methods do you try first?

Oh I get it. Positive methods don't work so hurt the dog and it'll do as it's told. Wow - very professional.
Do you care about dogs at all - because it certainly doesn't seem so.

Perfect - you took the words out of my mouth, Akitagirl!

Nope - you haven't! You may have got the odd Akita to do what you want by causing it pain. Once you're out of earshot and sight, any Akita you've used an e-collar on would go back to their usual stubborn ways.

Precisely. We had a few over the years that could never go off lead. The majority could with a bit of hard work, using positive methods. Those dogs of ours that never went off lead were just as happy and stimulated as those who did.

Laura xx



PS - Adam - Are you friends with Labman?!

Its funny Adam, I have avery high prey drive dog, I know that a zap on the highest level would not deter her away from her prey... a long time ago she even ripped 3 nails off her foot, in pursuit of another dog, luckily it came to nothing, but I learnt then nothing will stop her when that mist comes down, so to be perfectly blunt Adam, you are talking nonsense, for you to get a high prey drives dogs attention off its prey, you are going to have to inflict more than a slight stim to said dog.

I have seen dogs jump in the air from a zap of an e.collar..

Don't try to teach grandmothers to suck eggs, they will leave you in your nappies!
My you know what happens to big egos dont you.

Just a by note, the farmer in question, will no doubt exercise his dogs son his own land, hence not really having a problem with needing a recall, as setter girl will!!
Also you are making a huge assumption they the farmer does not give his dogs treats,,,

Your a dangerous young man Adam, with a huge ego, and god help the dogs that come to you for help.

You methods are abhorrent to any dog owner who has half a brain.

You have said , you entice an aggressive dog to show its aggression, so you can see the level of said dogs aggression, then , you get your e,collar out ans zap the life out of it.

Don't you know the first rule of rehabilitation, dont treat aggression with aggression


Somehting you would be wise to learn!!!

My too,

He seems to have trained everything. Very convenient.

For those of us with challenging dogs who don`t live in fantasy land like our Devon Dumpling, it isn`t `life on a lead` is it? We work with our dogs to give them quality of life, and find ways they can have fun safely.
Using Lines, enclosures, training clubs etc., finding sports we can do safely, using our brains to find outlets for their energy - and most of all, helping our dogs learn and develop. This what we do.
Of course, there are dogs who live a life on lead. They are usually small frustrated yappy and slightly desperate creatures being dragged along on a flexilead - never allowed to sniff or swim or run through undergrowth after exciting smells. Those are the dogs I feel sorry for. The `normal` ones who suffer from lazy and selfish owners. (and no, I don`t mean anyone on this forum! )
So well done to all those inventive people who find ways to give their challenging dogs a fulfilled life!

Very good point! Very well said.

I myself have picked up a few new ideas through this thread

Hello

I live with working sled dogs. After a 5am run through the forest, rest before breakfast, fun training session and garden zoomies, afternoon Kong followed by another nap, dinner then a pack hike, all surrounded by the buzz of family life .............they just about have the energy to raise a chuckle for folks who deem their 'life on a lead' as cruel

My guys free run in safe enclosed areas but given the choice of how they would choose to run, it would be in harness out in front of a rig every time

Sibe owners are constantly asked to justify why their dogs are not allowed to free run in certain areas and some trainers I know have bigger ego's than breed knowledge.

Dogs are kept on leads for many reasons. Their safety is paramount. Please don't let anyone make you feel your lad is hard done by if he is not off lead.

Best of luck with his training

Take good care.

Seoniad.