Clearly you have never had anything unexpected happen in your life then! Remind me to make sure my life does not change in any way whatsoever for the next ten years........

all dogs might potentually harm your child,good ones and bad ones ,its risk assesment and damage controll, for me.

The only "appalling" thing in this thread is your judgemental, holier-than-thou attitude.

Anyone who has read MOON'S MUM'S posts knows full well how much she loves Cain and how damned hard she has worked to try and help him.

She didn't know how reactive etc he is when she adopted him - she just knew he was a dog in need of a kind home. And she provided that and more.

So for you to now sit there and condemn her in this manner IS appalling. Get over yourself.

Ditto..........

Exactly, and only Moon'sMum can decide how much risk she is willing to take. It seems (from her posts) that Cain will be much higher risk than the average dog......

I sincerely hope Westie that nothing comes along to pierce your self satisfied world.

We never know what is around the corner.

As I have said before, Life is what happens when you are busy making other plans.

You are extremely lucky never to have been in a position where you have had to make terrible choices.

Some of us have.

Phrases such as:

"I would never/I cannot imagine/it is disgusting" may, if you are unlucky, come back to haunt you.

Nobody is perfect and all we can do is the best we can for those we love in the circumstances we find ourselves at the time.

For you, children may never come before animals, for most of us, they do and will.

What you think NOW is not necessarily the same attitude you will have as you mature.

We all (hopefully) evolve, and issues which seem black and white in our youth, tend to develop into more light and shade as we age.

As somebody else said here on another thread.

"Never say never".

YOUR situation is not the same as another's.

I also think it is unecessarily hurtful (and untrue) to label MM thoughts/actions as disgusting.

Personally I have a view about becoming potentially "over involved" so that you cannot "see the wood for the trees" and think a degree of "emotional detachment" is often required to make sound, logical decisions which can be life changing.

My first Weimaraner could never have been rehomed as a pet, and so I made arrangements for him to be PTS in the event of my demise.

Another that I rehomed would have had the same fate (had I not had him PTS first) as he was a dangerous liability.

Did I love them both? Yes. Did I make the right decision (in the case of the latter) undoubtedly yes (IMHO).

We all have a duty of care not only to our beloved animals but those who may be affected by THEIR actions and OUR acts and omissions.

Sometimes it behooves us to remember that.

well, if all else fails and cain has to go, i will take him. and see that he lives his life to his fullist. stranger things have happend!

Well, I knew it was only a matter of time before this thread turned. Thank you to everyone who can see where I am coming from and that I do not take this lightly.

Firstly, Akitagirl, short answer - yes, I would like nothing more than to try Cain with a child. If he was half the dope with the child as he is with me and others who he trusts, then I cannot think of a better dog to be around a child. My OH has researched akitas and it utterly convinced that Cain would be fine with a child because of their loyal traits, the realistic part of me still worries. It's the unpredictability, if he showed some display of discomfort then it would be easier to manage. However, even closely supervised, it would be all to easy for a snap incident to happen and suddenly I'd have a bitten child and potentially a dead dog on my hands and I'm responsible and have failed them all I ask myself if it is fair to put either of them in that position? However, there is every chance he would allow the child in his "trust" circle and could be fantastic, that of course I could never know until it happens. The question is....do you risk it?

Westie, you're entitled to your opinion and I'm sure that nothing I say will change the fact that I disgust you, but for the sake of clarity, I'll clear a few things up.

Yes, I have always wanted to have children. I've worked as a nanny and in a nursery, I work as a babysitter, I am good with children and have always known I would have them.

I got Cain under less than ideal circumstances. I had recently lost my darling dog Moon under unexpected and tragic circumstances, I couldn't bear an empty house so searched for another dog. I was distressed as I hit barriers with countless rescues who refused to consider me because I worked. Then I was asked if I would take Cain. He was a private rehome, dropped on my doorstep by an acquaintance. He wasn't assessed by a rescue, I knew little of his background, I didn't even get the chance to meet his previous owners. I had only seen a photo of him before he turned up on my doorstep. I was told he was a poor little 8 month old puppy, pushed around 5 different homes etc. I knew he was a handful, but was led to believe it was basically a big, bouncy untrained adolescent. I believed that all he needed was love, training and time and I could totally turn him around. Every time things went wrong I said "I'll look back in a year and laugh", I had no doubt that he could be turned into a totally normal dog. I had no reason to think he would impact on future decisions about having children.

I had no idea that he had aggression issues and I certainly did not understand the depth of them. I'll openly admit I was naive when I took him on. Absolutely. But by that time, he was in my house. What options were left? Turn him over to a rescue to see him put to sleep? I thought I could help him. And I have since spent countless hours and god knows how much money dedicating myself to trying to help him. And he is a lot better for it. But I don't think he'll ever be a normal dog - but how was I supposed to have known that when I took him on?

I would hope it's obvious that the last thing in the world that I want to do is rehome Cain. Goodness, if I was going to rehome him, I'd have done it years ago! But as dedicated as I am to my animals, I would not let any person dictate to me whether or not I was allowed to have children, and I am not willing to give up my desire to have a family (a huge life decision) because of a dog. I put my dog before most things in my life, but it seems a little unrealistic to me to make the life choice to find myself 40 years old and childless simply because I made a choice to try and turn around a dog who couldn't entirely be helped But I'm sure you'll disagree.

There are very few dog owners as committed as you are to Cain, that's obvious just from reading your posts on here

The fact that you are thinking about this decision, now, without even being pregnant, is proof of that.

Your last paragraph, is spot on. I wish you all the best no matter what you eventually decide, and good luck talking it over with your trainer xxx

The truth is MM, had you not kept Cain and worked so hard with him he'd more than likely be dead now. Living with a people fear reactive dog (who's nowhere near as bad as Cain!) I can totally understand where you're coming from. I think it's very commendable to consider the future now, especially as Cain may well have the possibility of another excellent home if needed.

That said, a lot can change from now until you have children. Dogs do, ime, become calmer as they age and if you continue to work with Cain as you have been it may well be possible to keep him. It might be another 10 years before you have children, anything can and will happen between now and that future event.

If it were me I'd do as someone else suggested - tell your trainer you have concerns and see what he can suggest before you go and ask specifically.