She might not be too keen to begin with, but persevere. Sometimes dogs are a bit unsure of the texture to begin with. The first time I gave my boy a chicken wing, I managed to snap a picture of him, the expression on his face was 'URRRGHH WHAT IS THAT?!' But that only lasted for a couple of minutes until he discovered how nice they were

Let us know how you get on!

Edit: Mini, couldn't agree more. And I would love to see him answer these questions. Unfortunately I don't think that will be the case, or we certainly won't get a full answer

Thank you FM and Sarah , I am considering it...

As the moment I feed a mixed diet containing meat, fish veg eggs (but the meat is cooked) and a little kibble.

I like to cook whole chickens and oxtail in a pressure cooker until soft then mince the lot bones and all, you end up with something resembling brawn . This can then be portioned/frozen and added to dry food.

I would certainly recommend the dried fish from Fish4dogs, it is excellent for cleaning teeth.

I have bought some minced lamb today to test how Chloe copes with raw meat.

For me the whole point of raw feeding is to be in control of your dogs diet by knowing exactly what goes into the dogs dish. I choose exactly what they get and when. Some commercial raw is just one step away from commercial dry as the manufactuers have all the control as to what goes into the food. They could be adding bits of this and bits of that and you won't have any control over it.

Some raw commercial companies are also starting to use poor quality ingredients (not referring to NI), which although is better than poor quality dry food is starting to slide down the slippery slope to that old adage of using excellent marketing to shift a crappy product.

Basically I don't trust pet food manufacturers after years of lies from them (and vets sponsored by them no less!)!

I also can't help but feel that some commercial raw companies are taking people for a ride by charging a premium price for what should essentially be a relatively cheap way to feed.

Although I'd always say feeding commercial raw is far better than feeding commercial dry, I'll still always be a huge advocate for what I see as true raw feeding. Paying a premium price for someone else to decide what my dog eats seems a bit pointless to me, but then of course I understand some people don't want the hassle of it all.

Bet you wished you never asked now!

I couldn't agree with you more! There do seem to be some extremely expensive ways of feeding your dog out there and to me the BARF route seems pretty straightforward to me - there's no need for cooking up complicated recipes or anything.

Well, I'm very pleased to report back that Millie has just spent the last hour chomping away on a chicken wing and it's just about all gone. She really seems to have enjoyed it! One question: what do people do to limit the impact of raw chicken being dragged everywhere or do you just chase after them with antibacterial wipes? (Mind you - I'm not that houseproud tbh!)

So, we've got a nice meaty bone for the next meal and I thought she could finish the day with some of the complete puppy food softened down with goat's milk and mixed up with scrambled egg and some carrot (if she will eat the disguised dry food that is - I've got a 2KG bag to use up somehow . . . not the orijen but a more cereal based one with oats: Supadog puppy)

I agree with you actually. I would advise people to do it themselves as it is so much cheaper, and really not all that hard one you get into it. But as you said, feeding a good quality preprepared raw food is better than feeding complete. I guess not even raw natural food is safe from the people who want to make money by cutting corners.

Let us know how you get on Mini! We used to feed our dogs very similar to how you do it, apart from the addition of raw chicken wings. It was only after getting a puppy who came from four generations of raw fed dogs, that we switched them all to raw. It's been the best thing we have ever done for them. I can't resist looking at Dolly's teeth. She is 11months old and I haven't had to clean them once

. . . they won't get chicken bones stuck in their throats will they? Millie has just finished crunching up the last bits of the raw chicken wing and made some very strange coughing and spluttering noises. I just gave her the wing whole and she dealt with it - should I have cut it up or something? I don't want her to get an injury from a piece of bone somewhere along the throat or elsewhere in the digestive canal!

No chicken wings are fine, if she coughs up a bit of bone dont be alarmed though, they are soft bones

Thanks - I've looked up the link but unfortunately only have access to the abstract (pasted below).

A few things I note:

* The study was quite small and the type of food given isn't mentioned in the abstract

* One has to assume that all factors other than food intake were kept constant, including overall health, amount and type of exercise, etc., although this isn't mentioned in the abstract

* There are no figures or exact quantities of food fed in the abstract. They say that one group was fed "ad libitum" - which means 'without restraint':

Definition: http://www.answers.com/topic/ad-libitum
Without restraint.

• a. l. feeding — food available at all times with the quantity and frequency of consumption being the free choice of the animal.

Whereas the other group was fed 25% less than this. Less than "without restraint"?

The way I'm reading the abstract is that the food-limited group were not severely restricted, starved or kept especially overly lean, it's just that they weren't freely fed - or allowed to have whatever food they wanted when they wanted (not stuffed full of food) - which is how many go about feeding their dogs on this site.

Thanks.



J Am Vet Med Assoc. 1992 Sep 15;201(6):857-63.
Effects of limited food consumption on the incidence of hip dysplasia in growing dogs.

Kealy RD, Olsson SE, Monti KL, Lawler DF, Biery DN, Helms RW, Lust G, Smith GK.
Pet Nutrition Research Department, Ralston Purina Co, St Louis, MO 63164.
Forty-eight 8-week-old Labrador Retrievers were allotted to 2 groups of 24 dogs each; 1 group was fed ad libitum and the other group was given 25% less of the same feed until the dogs were 2 years old. Radiography of the hip joints was done when the dogs were 30, 42, 54, 78, and 104 weeks old. Subluxation was measured by the Norberg angle on radiographs made with the dog in the standard (extended limb) position. Independent of age at which the radiography was done, there was less subluxation of the femoral heads in the limit-fed dogs. Using the Swedish method of hip joint evaluation on the same radiographs, it was found that fewer dogs on limited food intake had signs of hip dysplasia. Radiographs done when dogs were 2 years old, for all the methods used (Norberg angle in standard and frog-limb position, the Orthopedic Foundation for Animals [OFA] score, and the Swedish score), revealed less hip dysplasia (less joint subluxation and less degenerative joint disease) in the limit-fed dogs. Using the OFA method, 7 of the 24 limit-fed dogs and 16 of the 24 ad libitum-fed dogs were diagnosed as having hip dysplasia. Similarly, using the Swedish method, 5 of the 24 limit-fed dogs and 18 of the 24 ad libitum-fed dogs were diagnosed as having hip dysplasia. The food-intake-related differences were significant both for the OFA score and for the Swedish score.(ABSTRACT TRUNCATED AT 250 WORDS)

PMID: 1399793 [PubMed - indexed for MEDLINE]

My boys don't rate kibble much either. I buy the bags of free flow minced tripe which thaws instantly with a drop of hot tap water and forms the most delicious, yummy gravy.

The PM I sent you linked to a larger, newer study.