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Losos
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11-11-2009, 12:18 PM
Originally Posted by Shona View Post
I think the Sun newspaper has done more to make him look foolish than anyone, lets face it we all know who the media work, they will always find some tiny thing and blow it up.
Don't like the Sun, never have and never will, but they seem to be able to get people to not only read their rag but pay for it as well.

I can honestly say I've never ever bought a copy, I have occassionaly seen a copy left on a tube train seat or lying around in the office, apparently they've decided to support Cameron at the next election so to make their decision work they need to get the knife into GB at every opportunity. It's just a shame GB won't get the knife into those who are messing him around.
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Shona
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11-11-2009, 12:20 PM
I would hate to have the death of my son, all over the papers and tv, due to a spelling error in a personal letter, then have transcripts of a private phone call from the pm all over the place as well,
it just seems to belittle the death of her son, he should be in the public eye for his bravery and dedication to his country.
the media has really surpassed itself on this one.
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Jackie
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11-11-2009, 03:51 PM
Originally Posted by Shona View Post
I would hate to have the death of my son, all over the papers and tv, due to a spelling error in a personal letter, then have transcripts of a private phone call from the pm all over the place as well,
it just seems to belittle the death of her son, he should be in the public eye for his bravery and dedication to his country.
the media has really surpassed itself on this one.
I agree with all you say, personally if it was me, it would be a private matter.

But grief is not rational, and peopel will react in different ways.

Maybe the spelling mistakes in the letter was the factor that tipped her anger and grief over the edge, and making it public, who knows, its horrendous how ever what you look at it.

She has her reasons for doing what she did, maybe she regrets it , maybe not.

But the fact is the letter is insensitive to a grieving family, no matter his good intentions, and and as politics being as it is, he opened himself up for more flack, if it was not this , it will be something else.

Using his poor eyesight is not a good enough reason to explain the error, (not that he has)

I watched him on the Andrew Marr show a while ago, going to great lengths to ensure his vision impairment plays no adverse part in his being able to do his job,


If now , some are using this as an excuse, for his gaff, then its worrying, how can you have a PM how cant see what he is writing or reading.

I am sure what ever the reason he uses for this incident he wont use his eyesight as an excuse for not being able to read what is put in front of him... I am would think he would be horrified if peopel thought that!!

The sun is trash, and I am sure they were delighted to jump on GB with this story, but if they did not get the exclusive, someone else would have.

There is politics involved, as always, but the fact is he got it wrong, made a insensitive mistake to a grieving family, and as such is paying the price.
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Meg
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11-11-2009, 03:58 PM
I would normally be the last person to offer support to Gorden Brown but in this instance I think he has been treated very badly by certain areas of the press.

GB is the first PM to send hand written letters of condolence, previously the letters were typed then signed by the PM (this was confirmed on the BBCs 'World at one' yesterday).

It seems to me GB is genuinely distressed by the deaths of our soldiers and I would guess he is probably ridden with guilt that the government he is part of took us into this ill conceived war in the first place (long before he became PM).

I think to secretly tape a private telephone conversation made by the PM as a gesture of support and goodwill then to make it public is disgraceful.

I also think in time the grieving mother who first spoke out while in a shock/anguish/anger at her loss will regret ever having done so and will see that she was manipulated by certain areas of the media.
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Pidge
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11-11-2009, 04:42 PM
Originally Posted by Jackbox View Post
GB was not being decent in handwriting the letter, it is the duty of the given PM of the day to do so... it has always been this way,

There is a protocol for hand written letter to the relatives of deceived solders.

And sadly GB broke them....the most fundamental basics of handwriting a letter, there is no excuse, he sent these boys to war,(along with his government) the least he can do is get it right when writing a letter of condolence.



As for the sun manipulating the mother, if I read it correctly she is the one who instigated the issue, incensed by the lack of thought in his letter.





The busy man we are talking about is the leader of the Country, the man who takes us into wars, I wonder if you would use the same excuse "he is a busy man" if he instigated a major catastrapy , and them used the excuse, sorry, I was to busy to take the time to check my spelling!!!!!!!!!!




Thats a poor excuse, if the mans job which includes reading and writing, is impaired by his sight, then maybe he should not be int he job.

I know someone who has sight in only one eye. and believe me if you said, use that as an excuse for poor grammar, and spelling , he would give you what for... his writing and spelling is impeccable!!

This man is the man with his finger on the button, given your excuse of his poor spelling and grammar to his eyesight, it is a worrying concept if he pushed the wrong button in a situation of war, or ticked the yes in stead of the no box, simply because he has impaired vision




I think there is far more to this, I think it is just a explosion of emotion from the citizen of this Country, we are sick of seeing body bags being brought home week in week out, we see no end to this war, and then when we see an poorly penned letter of condolence from the PM, it is bound to stir up feeling,

So its understandable the mother of this boy reacted the way she did.

Maybe she is voicing her displeasure, in the only way she can.

If the PM, cant take the time to check over the letters he is writing to the relatives of his soldiers, then what else is he falling down on,

At best he could have passed it to an aid to check for any errors!!

And we have not even touched on the recording

All he could say is "he is sorry" she feels upset"

No mention of his sorrow for the content of the letter being sloppy.
Like I said before, I think the incredible similarity of the names, as well as the fact that James is a more common surname excuses this in my opinion. I know what you mean because of course it boils down to attention to detail but human error happens. He apologised personally so imo there is nothing more to say about it and yet here we (the press) are, days later and stilll talking about it.

Originally Posted by Shona View Post
I would hate to have the death of my son, all over the papers and tv, due to a spelling error in a personal letter, then have transcripts of a private phone call from the pm all over the place as well,
it just seems to belittle the death of her son, he should be in the public eye for his bravery and dedication to his country.
the media has really surpassed itself on this one.
I agree!

Originally Posted by Minihaha View Post
I would normally be the last person to offer support to Gorden Brown but in this instance I think he has been treated very badly by certain areas of the press.

GB is the first PM to send hand written letters of condolence, previously the letters were typed then signed by the PM (this was confirmed on the BBCs 'World at one' yesterday).

It seems to me GB is genuinely distressed by the deaths of our soldiers and I would guess he is probably ridden with guilt that the government he is part of took us into this ill conceived war in the first place (long before he became PM).

I think to secretly tape a private telephone conversation made by the PM as a gesture of support and goodwill then to make it public is disgraceful.

I also think in time the grieving mother who first spoke out while in a shock/anguish/anger at her loss will regret ever having done so and will see that she was manipulated by certain areas of the media.
Hmmm, the conspiracy theorist iin me now wonders whether it's becoming a cleverly played popularity contest for a pretty well, un-liked man ;o)
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tinkladyv
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11-11-2009, 09:47 PM
Originally Posted by Lorna View Post
I think the mother will have been upset and will have taken it as an insult that her son gave up his life etc. However, I think it was wrong that she plastered it through the world's media, I think its a lovely gesture that he hand writes the letters, and I think she should have appreciated his efforts. Now I hate the labour party, but even I can see that he was trying to do a good thing there.

He's blind in one eye and partially sighted in the other, I think she's been really unfair and I think she should see what he is trying to do is a very considerate thing. At the end of the day her son signed on that dotted line and it is a lovely thing for him to do to apologise for her loss! Do you really think Tony Blair would have??
Yes!!!!!!!!!!!!
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tinkladyv
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11-11-2009, 10:01 PM
Originally Posted by Jackbox View Post
GB was not being decent in handwriting the letter, it is the duty of the given PM of the day to do so... it has always been this way,

There is a protocol for hand written letter to the relatives of deceived solders.

And sadly GB broke them....the most fundamental basics of handwriting a letter, there is no excuse, he sent these boys to war,(along with his government) the least he can do is get it right when writing a letter of condolence.



As for the sun manipulating the mother, if I read it correctly she is the one who instigated the issue, incensed by the lack of thought in his letter.





The busy man we are talking about is the leader of the Country, the man who takes us into wars, I wonder if you would use the same excuse "he is a busy man" if he instigated a major catastrapy , and them used the excuse, sorry, I was to busy to take the time to check my spelling!!!!!!!!!!




Thats a poor excuse, if the mans job which includes reading and writing, is impaired by his sight, then maybe he should not be int he job.

I know someone who has sight in only one eye. and believe me if you said, use that as an excuse for poor grammar, and spelling , he would give you what for... his writing and spelling is impeccable!!

This man is the man with his finger on the button, given your excuse of his poor spelling and grammar to his eyesight, it is a worrying concept if he pushed the wrong button in a situation of war, or ticked the yes in stead of the no box, simply because he has impaired vision




I think there is far more to this, I think it is just a explosion of emotion from the citizen of this Country, we are sick of seeing body bags being brought home week in week out, we see no end to this war, and then when we see an poorly penned letter of condolence from the PM, it is bound to stir up feeling,

So its understandable the mother of this boy reacted the way she did.

Maybe she is voicing her displeasure, in the only way she can.

If the PM, cant take the time to check over the letters he is writing to the relatives of his soldiers, then what else is he falling down on,

At best he could have passed it to an aid to check for any errors!!

And we have not even touched on the recording

All he could say is "he is sorry" she feels upset"

No mention of his sorrow for the content of the letter being sloppy.
I cant beleive im hearing this?!
"Thats a poor excuse, if the mans job which includes reading and writing, is impaired by his sight, then maybe he should not be int he job."
People with disabilitys can do things we so called able bodied people can, just because it is not the same way we do things, does not mean they shouldnt do them.

You also say "I know someone who has sight in only one eye. and believe me if you said, use that as an excuse for poor grammar, and spelling , he would give you what for... his writing and spelling is impeccable!!"
Well my grandmother is blind in one eye and pretty much in the other, it does not deter her writing, but her spelling appears poor, not because it is, but because of her impairment, she often misses letters and forgets where she is in a word.Its really hard to read what she is saying, but i would never write for her and people understand, its her independense.
As i have also said i know someone else again with an impairment who struggles, so whilst it may be ok for some it is certainly not for all and Gordon Brown has my full sympathies on this disgusting abuse of greif to get at him!
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tinkladyv
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11-11-2009, 10:05 PM
Originally Posted by Lorna View Post
I don't like him either, but I think what he did was a lovely gesture and I don't think anyone will need to lose their job, a simple, "I'm sorry" would suffice...
I do like him, but agree no one needs to lose their job.
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tinkladyv
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11-11-2009, 10:11 PM
Originally Posted by Losos View Post
Isn't that the problem He will be 'generous' over the original mistake about the name, and he has been 'generous' over the Attorney General who can't even abide by her own laws (Not ones written by others, but one she had a hand in writing herself) and there are plenty more cases where he should have been more 'hard' for want of a better word. He has been 'gentle' and 'generous' in writing to this lady, but you can't be 'gentle' and 'generous' when people are messing you about and making you look a fool.

When you are PM the people who supply you with information must get it right, or face the consequences, this whole episode has made the British Prime Minister look foolish and consequently it has made you, me, and everyone look foolish too.
Its a matter of opinion, i think there are alot of people who do see him in a good light and admire his ways, unfortunatly this does not come across well in TV and he is not a good speaker, but i dont want a great speaker or TV personality, i want a good polotician and i do not feel a fool!
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tinkladyv
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11-11-2009, 10:14 PM
Originally Posted by Shona View Post
I think the Sun newspaper has done more to make him look foolish than anyone, lets face it we all know who the media work, they will always find some tiny thing and blow it up.
Exactly Shona and i think from the majority response here and for that matter around the country, its the sun that look foolish...Hoorah!

Ps, sorry about all the posts but cant figure out the multi quote thing!
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