I think he sums it up perfectly

here here, I thought he said it better than I could!

Good to see some are owning up to the problem, I suppose baby steps are better than nothing.

PW, some breeds only need baby steps at this point, in terms of genetic diversity. It would be good to get all 'ethical' breeders to a solid knowledge-base of understanding where their breed is in terms of COI etc, and working as a community to bring that down where possible. There is a heck of a long way to go, and until then I shall continue to use ethical in parentheses in that context LOL.

Mary

Only baby steps are needed? or baby steps the most we can hope for? The study by scientists at Imperial College discovered pedigree dogs are much more heavily inbred than had previously been demonstrated. What would you see as an acceptable COI?

With the knowledge that inbreeding damages health why are breeders continuing to linebreed? Unfortunately I believe it 's not due to lack of knowledge but the choice of ignoring that knowledge. The aftermath of the Pedigree dogs exposed programme and the lack of acceptance leads me to believe government intervention is the only way. The fact we have not signed up to the European Convention for the Protection of Pet Animals speaks volumes

PW,

All successful revolutions come from within, history tells us that....in terms of sustainability etc.

However, 'enlightened' breeders are in a minority so it may well come to external intervention (at my own breed show yesterday I was asked to consider a half-sibling mating: they knew I would never agree, but I was told it was a 'classic'. It sure was, I said, but the irony was lost....)

As for what I consider to be an OK COI I honestly can't answer that as well you know...it needs to be in the context of last 6-10 generations for the answer to make sense. I can say I would like to see a downward trend with successive matings.... but since most people on here don't appear work with COI in population group as a whole or possibly not with their own matings, we need to persuade them that COI is of value and how it can help.

It will come eventually, how much better for dogs if breeders stepped up to the plate now. But I expect I will see more people writing on boards on net instead of doing some reading. It is frustrating, but I am bowing out of this thread for a bit, when people are ready and curious they will ask and take steps to find out. It is their responsibility.

Mary

Well fwiw you've gain my respect, it's easy for me to complain and point out where breeders are going wrong but for someone within the show/breeding world to try and make improvements takes guts. On behalf of the dogs Thank You.



Going by what I've heard and read, take for example these comments from Ronnie Irving and so called top breeders http://www.ourdogs.co.uk/, I doubt they'll be a significant change from within, there seems to be a lot of holding breaths and waiting for the storm to die down so they can all continue as they always have been, and worse ridiculous excuses being given. Again going back to the ECPPA why haven't the public kicked up a fuss about us not signing up, too much faith in the KC? hopefully now dogs owners will start to open their eyes. http://www.petparliament.com/viewart...sid=144&aid=87

This is a massive problem and unfortunately there's a very real risk that in a few months this will all be brushed under the carpet and breeders will continue as they always have done. I've added some links below for anyone who would like to learn more about this disastrous problem forced upon our pedigree dogs.

Study carried out by the Imperial College London

A Vet Explains

The Canine Diversity Project

Canadian 2007 Study

BVA talk by vet Emma Milne

CAWC Report 2006

Hellmuth Wachtel 1997 Hellmuth Wachtel 2008

Jeffery Bragg Report 1999

The BBC Documentary (Part 1 of 6)

Beverley Cuddy of Dogs Today magazine, Ryan O'Meara of K9 magazine and Terrier Man's Blog, all do very good jobs of explaining the crisis in laymans terms see links below. If you have the time please do read through them

Dogs Today Magazine
http://coldwetnose.blogspot.com/2008/08/pe...gs-exposed.html
http://coldwetnose.blogspot.com/2008/09/pe...d-avoiding.html
http://coldwetnose.blogspot.com/2008/09/kc...s-clothing.html

K9 Magazine
http://www.dogmagazine.net/archives/704/pe...n-to-help-dogs/
http://www.dogmagazine.net/archives/712/wh...about-eugenics/
http://www.dogmagazine.net/archives/813/rs...s-why-withdraw/
http://www.dogmagazine.net/archives/840/ou...fts-withdrawal/
http://www.dogmagazine.net/archives/900/pe...-opinion-piece/

Terrier Man's Blog
http://terriermandotcom.blogspot.com/2008/...-dogs-data.html
http://terriermandotcom.blogspot.com/2006/...d-thinking.html
http://terriermandotcom.blogspot.com/2008/...ts-like-it.html
http://terriermandotcom.blogspot.com/2008/...-show-ring.html
http://terriermandotcom.blogspot.com/2008/...ncovenient.html

Statements from the RSPCA
http://www.rspca.org.uk/servlet/Satellite?...41&marker=1
http://www.rspca.org.uk/servlet/Satellite?...88&marker=1

Not sure if this is on here already

http://www.webchats.tv/chat/wwwthekennelcluborguk

Think I will pass on that one thanks

Talk about hysteria